Thursday, September 11, 2014

Two Catholic Conferences this week end - how would they interpret the Catechism of the Catholic Church ?

Call to Holiness Conference @ Best Western Sterling Heights | Sterling Heights | Michigan | United States
Two Catholic Conferences are to be held this week in the USA.Their speakers  will interpret the Catechism of the Catholic Church 846 with the same irrational premise they use, in the interpretation of Vatican Council II, Redemptoris Missio, Dominus Iesus etc.
CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers? Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:
Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.
 sm-room-crIt is the same Catechism of the Catholic Church but we have different interpretations of CCC 846. For me CCC 847 and 848 are not exceptions to CCC 846 (and CCC 845). For the members of the two Conferences they are exceptions to Tradition. 
Here CCC 846 affirms the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door-CCC 846
 
The above passage is Feeneyite. CCC 846 is Feeneyite here.
 
Speakers at the two conferences will interpret the following passage from CCC 846 as being opposed to the one above.They will use the Cushingite approach that of known exceptions.
Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.-CCC 846.
It will be wrongly assumed that those who 'know' or those who are in 'invincible ignorant' are visible to us in 2014.This is the false premise. Then it will be concluded that these visible cases, personally known on earth, are explicit exceptions to the passage above. It will be inferred that they are exceptions to extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
 
So first it will be judged and inferred that we know on earth those 'who know' but did not enter the Church and those who are in invincible ignorant. Then it will be inferred that these cases who are really known only to God, are exceptions to the necessity of faith and Baptism for all in 2014.
Catholic Identity Conference 2014 flyer 
The passage above  does not say that they are visible to us or that here is an exception to extra ecclesiam nulla salus.However this will be inferred even though it is not in the text.
The false premise will be used by the Conference members and the result is a non traditional conclusion.
So when it is said that every one needs to be a formal member of the Catholic Church for salvation by the speakers at the Catholic Identity Conference it will be denied by the speakers at the Call to Holiness Conference.  The Call to Holiness speakers will quote CCC 846 to reject Feeneyism. They will say that all salvation comes from Jesus and the Church i.e those who are saved with the baptism of water and those saved without the baptism of water ( baptism of desire, invincible ignorance etc) are saved through Jesus and the Chruch.But where are the cases saved without the baptism of water in 2014? There are none! Those saved with the baptism of desire and without the baptism of water are hypothetical cases. I could also say , hypothtically that there can be a case of a person saved with the baptism of desire followed by the baptism of water.Either way these hypothetical cases are not exceptions to all needing to be formal members of the Church for salvation.Since they do not exist in our reality.They are 'zero cases' for us. All still need faith and Baptism in 2014 to avoid Hell.
 messe_mit_wandlungskerze_beuron
Similarly members of both Conferences will state that 'God is not limited to the Sacraments'(CCC 1257).In other words they know of some person in 2014 who has been saved without  the baptism of water in the Catholic Church! The progressivists and traditionalists make this error.
This is the irrationality used in the interpretation of the Catechism of the Catholic Church.It is with this irrationality that the Call to Holiness speakers will reject the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla  salus and cite Vatican Council II ( with the premise) and the Catechism of the Catholic Church (846,1257) also interpreted with the false premise.
The Catholic Identity Conference speakers will call attention to Vatican Council II and the Catechism of the Catholic Church being a break with the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. They will reject these Church documents interpreted with the false premise. But they are not aware of the false premise.
So the fault is not with Vatican Council II and the Catechism of the Catholic in a such much as they can be interpreted without the false premise and the conclusion is traditional.
-Lionel Andrades
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Two Catholic Conferences this week end : how would they interpret Dominus Iesus ?

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2014/09/two-catholic-conferences-this-week-end.html



 
Two Catholic Conferences this week end: how would they interpret Redemptoris Missio?  http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2014/09/two-catholic-conferences-this-week-end_11.html
 


Interpreting Vatican Council II according to Tradition

 
 
 
WE DON'T KNOW ANY MUSLIM SAVED FOLLOWING HIS GOOD CONSCIENCE SO IT DOES NOT CONTRADICT THE DOGMA OUTSIDE THE CHURCH NO SALVATION

 

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