Sunday, February 15, 2015

St.Emerentiana is not an exception to extra ecclesiam nulla salus, the Feeneyite version, in 2015

Comments from the blogpost.1

Lionel said: "Every human creature in the present times needs to enter the Catholic Church for salvation! 

Lionel:
Yes, this us what the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus says.
This is also the teaching of Vatican Council II (AG 7).
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Those who are taught or not taught, those who know or do not know about the Church, will be decided by Jesus".
Lionel:
It means they are not known to us and they are known only to Jesus. So they do not contradict the dogma nor Vatican Council II.

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as compared to: ◦“There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved.” (Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, 1215.)

Lionel:
All need to be Catholic. Yes.
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The pronouncement by Pope Innocent III is the perfect decree and of course it is directed only to those that are alive.

Lionel:
Yes. It does not say that we can know who 'knows' or does not know. It refers to all.
Those who know about the Church need to enter and those who do not know(theoretically for us), need to enter. Those who do not know have Original Sin and commit mortal sins e.g natives and pagans in the jungles.

It was because Cardinal Marchetti assumed that there was known salvation outside the Church ; we knew those who were exceptions, i.e those who did not have the baptism of water and was saved, he inferred that only those who knew need to enter the Church, as compared to those in invincible ignorance who could be saved.

So this line was inserted in Vatican Council II (AG 7,LG 14 with respect to all needing 'faith and baptism'.)

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It certainly is not directed to the deceased.

Lionel: 
The decased are not exceptions to the dogma in the present times. They are not exceptions as Marchetti believed they were.For him the deceased were visible exceptions to the dogma.
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There are problems with your quote and by example the Church has confirmed Sainthood on Catechumens/Martyrs who are certainly known to us.
Lionel: 
They are deceased. So they are not exceptions to the dogma. 
Those who are saved with the baptism of desire or blood are not an issue. It is only when it is inferred that they are exceptions to the dogma that the problem arise. It would mean they are alive to be exceptions.Cardinal Francesco Marchetti Selvaggiani made this objective error.
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They were not possibilities but confirmed facts.
Lionel:
Yes and if there were hundreds of them they would be deceased and so not relevant to the dogmatic teaching in 2015.
St.Emerentiana is not an exception to extra ecclesiam nulla salus, the Feeneyite version, in 2015.SSPX and FSSP priests usually make this objective error.
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It is not for you to question or speculate how God and Jesus welcomed them into Heaven.

Lionel:
However Jesus may welcome a deceased person,it is not relevant to the dogmatic teaching. Since people who are deceased cannot be exceptions or relevant to the dogma in the present times (2015).
-Lionel Andrades




1

Every one needs to be a Catholic : Those who are taught or not taught, those who know or do not know about the Church, will be decided by Jesus.

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2015/02/every-one-needs-to-be-catholic-those.html




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