Michael Voris does not say every one needs to be a card carrying member of the Church for salvation. For him there are exceptions.

DO NON-CATHOLICS GO TO HELL?

April 24, 2015 | The Vortex

http://www.churchmilitant.com/video/episode/do-non-catholics-go-to-hell

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Do all non-Catholics go to Hell? It's a question that has been the subject of many heated conversations.

Lionel:

Michael Voris cannot answer the question directly or there will be an uproar from the Archdiocese of Detroit and the political Left. 
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But there is a deeper question here, because there is a deeper principle involved. The deeper principle beyond being a “card-carrying, on the parish rolls” 

Lionel:

He does not say every one needs to be a card carrying member of the Church for salvation. For him there are exceptions. The baptism of desire and being saved in invincible ignorance are exceptions.If he does not say these cases are exceptions, he would not be supporting 'good relations with the Jews'( of the Left).
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Catholic is: How does one actually attain salvation? What is necessary for salvation? What is necessary to get to Heaven? That is the more fundamental question here, the foundation from which springs the further question about being in the Catholic Church.

Lionel:

The fundamental teaching was that every one needs the baptism of water in the Catholic Church for salvation.This was referred to as exclusivist ecclesiology. This is rejected by  Michael Voris.
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The Church teaches that one must be in a state of grace upon death to achieve salvation. And a person can only be in either a state of grace or a state of mortal sin.

Lionel:

If  one dies outside the Church, without Catholic Faith and the baptism of water, it is a mortal sin of Faith.It leads to Hell.

If there are any exceptions we humans cannot know of them.They would only be known to God.

So there cannot be any defacto exception to the ordinary means of salvation 'faith and baptism'(AG 7, LG 14 )
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 If a person dies in a state of unrepented mortal sin, he descends immediately and directly into Hell for all eternity, where he suffers the tortures of his demonic masters—but is most tortured from his everlasting separation from God, whom he knows he was created to be with and yet detests at the same time.

So the primary question is: How does a person achieve a state of grace? A state of grace is the state where the life of the Blessed Trinity is present in the soul. Sanctifying grace comes to the soul for the first moment in baptism and helps to sustain the supernatural virtues: the theological virtues of faith, hope and charity. A man dying without these virtues dies without God. He is owned by Hell.

It is impossible to possess these virtues without sanctifying grace. Mortal sin (mortal coming from the Latin morte, “death”) means the supernatural life of the soul is now gone. The soul is dead spiritually. It still for a while possesses its natural aspect of giving life to the body, animating the flesh—but when the end comes, not only is the body dead, but the soul remains in a perpetual state of death: the Second Death of which the Scriptures speak. Its now everlasting pain is to have to endure death when it was created for divine life. 

How to avoid this worst of all realities is to die not in a state of deadly sin, but in a state of life—divine life. Our Blessed Lord points out the way most vividly and lovingly: “If you love Me you will keep My commandments, and My Father and I will come to you and We will make Our home in you” (John 14:15). This is the most direct way to understand what is meant by a state of grace—that the Holy Trinity takes up residence in our souls. God lives in us; we are in a perpetual state of possessing divine grace—divine life.

The only thing that can alter this most precious of all realities is to commit mortal sin.  When that happens, God immediately flees, for He cannot abide sin. It is an abomination to Him. Purity cannot abide that which is impure. 

So the key to the question “Is there salvation outside the Church?” is to first understand that the Church’s role is to assist souls in attaining and maintaining a state of grace.

Lionel:

Is there salvation outside the Church? Has the dogma been contradicted?

Yes for Cardinal Marchetti in the Letter of the Holy Office 1949. Yes for Michael Voris at Church Militant and especially in this video.

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 This is the sole purpose for the sacraments: to infuse supernatural grace into the soul, visible signs instituted by Our Lord for the imparting of grace.

Now true, God’s grace is not bound by the sacraments.

Lionel:

False.God's grace for salvation is bound to the Sacraments according to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. God has chosen to restrict salvation to the Sacraments.
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 He can certainly operate outside of them.

Lionel:

He can but Michael Voris cannot infer that he knows of any such case or that this case known to him, is an explicit exception to the dogma (Cantate Dominio, Council of Florence 1441). This was the Marchetti-Cushing error.This is the error approved by the Left. It is the false premise, inference and conclusion. It is confusion.

Voris chooses to be liberal and politically correct here.

'God’s grace is not bound by the sacraments', since there are known cases saved outside the Church for Michael Voris.They  are personally known to him.They would have to be known in the present times to be exceptions.So he says God's grace it not bound to the Sacraments (CCC 1257)

Vatican Council II is also a break with the  rigorist interpretation of the dogma since LG 16,UR 3,NA 2 etc refer to known cases in the present times saved without the baptism of water and Catholic Faith. It is no surprise that Vatican Council II is ambigous for him. Since there are the orthodox passages and there are passages which refer to known salvation in the present times for Michael Voris. 

For me there are no exceptions in Vatican Council II to the dogma. Since there are the orthodox passages and there are passages which do not refer to known salvation in the present times. They refer to cases of people who would finally also be saved with the baptism of water in the Catholic Church, in a way known to God.This would be dogmatic.The text any way does not say that these cases are known to us.

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 He did in such manifest cases as the conversion of St. Paul, for example.

Lionel:

Yes, God choose to do so.However how can Michael Voris infer that these cases are known exceptions to the dogma which says all need to formally enter the Church to avoid the fires of Hell? How can it be an exception today? It would have to happen today to be an exception? The dogma refers to all needing 'faith and baptism' today. Does Michael Voris know of someone who does not need to formally enter the Church this April ?
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 Saul received a singular grace of conversion. And while that grace was not mediated through a formal sacrament, it nevertheless did come through the Church—as all graces do. It was after all the Church that was praying non-stop for relief from the murderous Saul.  In answer to the prayer of the Church about Saul, God sent them Paul.

Lionel:

How is what happened centuries back a defacto exception to all needing to enter the Church with Catholic Faith and the baptism of water to go to Heaven?

Can someone from the past be a known exception to the dogma today?

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The purpose of the Church in the grand scheme is to create saints, to make us holy. As St. Peter tells us, “You are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people of His own” (1 Peter 2:9). When he wrote his first letter, the first Pope was speaking to the first Catholics. We Catholics sometimes forget this truth, owing to the Protestant co-opting of the Scriptures as though they belonged to them. They most certainly do not. They never have.

The Bible, the canon of Scripture is Catholic, period. So the formula laid out for us in Scripture has specific and singular reference to those souls who are alive within the body of Christ—His Catholic Church. When Catholic souls plunge into spiritual death through committing mortal sin, they have a sacramental remedy to be resurrected: the sacrament of confession.

But when a non-Catholic soul, even one baptized in some Protestant denomination, falls into mortal sin, what remedy does it possess? Short of an act of perfect contrition prior to death, nothing. Such a man dies in his mortal sin.

The debate over salvation outside the church is kind of a moot question then, as it’s generally argued. The example case is always brought up: Does the “good” Protestant husband and father go to Hell because he wasn’t Catholic?

Lionel:

According to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus Protestants and Orthodox Christians are on the way to Hell.

According to Vatican Council II (AG 7,LG 14) all need Catholic Faith for salvation. Protestants and Orthodox Christians do not have it.

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That question is framed totally incorrectly. It should not be asked, “Will he go to Heaven if he wasn’t Catholic?” 

Lionel:

The dogma indicates he is on the way to Hell.

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but, “Was he in a state of grace—and if he wasn’t Catholic, how was it possible for him to be in a state of grace?” Now, we can never know with any certitude, of course, the disposition of any particular soul; that is completely in the realm of Our Lord as Judge.

Lionel:

The ordinary way of salvation is Catholic Faith and the baptism of water. We cannot know of any exception.We cannot judge someone to be an exception.

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 But in the hypothetical discussions people engage in, we can ask these questions. We speak in hypotheticals because principles of understanding fall from them. 

And the singular principle that falls from all of this is: It is much more difficult to be saved if you are not a Catholic with access to the sacraments to restore you to and keep you in a state of grace. Faithful sacrament-frequenting Catholics are much more likely to be saved than anyone else because such a man is much more likely to die in a state of grace—which is necessary to be saved.

This is the whole point of evangelizing: to help people understand the perilous risk to which they are exposing their souls if they do not become Catholic and faithfully receive the sacraments given to us by Our Lord Himself for our salvation.

All salvation comes through the Catholic Church, and outside of Her there is no salvation.

Lionel:

Every one with no exception needs to be 'a cary carrying member' of the Catholic Church for salvation.

When Michael Voris says 'All salvation comes through the Catholic Church'(CCC 846) he  infers that there are known exceptions. It suggests that there is salvation outside the Church.This was the mistake in the Catechism.The influence of the error can be seen in Redemptoris Missio and Dominus Iesus which do not affirm the traditional and rigorist interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.

-Lionel Andrades

SSPX must continue to reject Vatican Council II and other magisterial documents interpreted with the false premise and conclusion ? : ChurchMilitant TV still does not respond

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2015/04/sspx-must-continue-to-reject-vatican_25.html