Thursday, September 3, 2015

Andrea Tornielli needs to see the nonsense theology being forced upon the Franciscans of the Immaculate and the SSPX

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Andrea Tornielli
Andrea Tornielli needs to see the nonsense theology being forced upon the Franciscans  of the Immaculate and the SSPX
Andrea Tornielli at La Stampa/ Vatican Insider must know that there is no doctrinal problem in the Franciscans of the Immaculate (F.I) and the SSPX  issue, if he and the rest of the Staff at La Stampa, consider Lumen Gentium 16 (LG 16) as being implicit  and not explicit, invisible and not invisible to us.This is the key.
Revolve it around the FFI/SSPX  issue  and it will unlock a successful agreement between the Vatican and these communities, now in an irregular situation.
 When the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate  ask to offer only the Traditional Latin Mass , in their community, they mean they want only the old ecclesiology.
They can have only the old ecclesiology if they consider LG 16 Vatican Council II  as being theoretical and not defacto known  in personal cases They are  hypothetical and not practically seen.Only the old ecclesiology is rational.
It's as simple as this.It was so simple that every one overlooked it.
If Andrea Tornielli interprets all salvation in Heaven as being implicit for him and explicit only for God, then there is nothing in Vatican Council II to contradict the 'rigorist interpretation' of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS).EENS is central to the old ecclesiology which the F.I and SSPX want.

If Andrea Tornielli understands and accepts this then it means he has to reject the new ecclesiology of Pope Benedict and Pope Francis.It has to be rejected since it is based on salvation in Heaven being explicit for us and explicit also for God. This is irrational.It creates nonsense  theology, Catholics are not obliged to follow it.
It is this nonsense theology that the Franciscans of the Immaculate are refusing to accept and so want to hold on to the old Mass, only.They are not aware that they can offer the new Mass  also with this old ecclesiology, which is rational and traditional. They have a choice  but are unaware of it.Ecclesiology does not depend on the liturgy. Lex Orandi Lex Credendi (the law of praying is the law of believing).As we pray we worship and we can pray with the doctrines of the old or new ecclesiology.

Yesterday I was at the Salesian bookstop in front of Termini, Rome and I noticed a colourful magazine for young Catholics on the subject of dialogue with non Christians.There were techniques given, different approaches, new suggestions and there was a picture of Chiara Lubich of the Focolares BUT THERE WAS NO DOCTRINE!
These young people were not doing dialogue with the ecclesiology of Don Bosco.They would have to dialogue with a Vatican Council II in which LG 16 is explicit and so a break with Don Bosco's understanding of the dogma EENS. It is this LG 16 irrationality that the Franciscans  of the Immaculate and Fr.Stefano Mannelli F.I , the founder, would want to avoid.Even the Secretary General of the F.I as a priest would not want to proclaim and teach this irrationality.

In dialogue for a Muslim it is clear for him that the Quran and Islamic Tradition says non Muslims are going to Hell.Yet for a young Catholic this is not clear, since he or she uses the LG 16 is explicit inference.So doctrine is changed in dialogue for a Catholic.
For a Muslim it is clear tht he cannot marry a non Catholic unless the spouse converts to Islam , since non Muslims are going to  Hell.While with the new ecclesiology a Catholic can marry a non Catholic, since there is salvation outside the Church.LG 16, UR 3, NA 2 etc  all refer to salvation outside the Church.They refer to explicit and not implicit cases, so they refer to exceptions to the old traditional interpretation of EENS.
See the difference!
This is what  the Franciscans of the Immaculate are fighting for when they say TLM only!
Vatican Insider could at least discuss this subject so that the Vatican Curia can see how nonsensical and heretical  their magisterial position is.
How can we humans see people in Heaven saved with the baptism of desire or invincible ignorance?
How can we also see these cases in Heaven saved without the baptism of water ?
 Do we have some Superman or super human sight or insight in general?
 How can these cases which are invisible be exceptions to all needing to convert into the Church today?
Why should the Franciscans and the SSPX be forced to accept LG 16, UR 3, NA 2 etc as referring to visible on earth cases?
Does the SSPX have to accept lunatic theories to gain canonical status?
The SSPX and F.I  are not opposed to Vatican Council II per se but Vatican Council II in which LG 16, LG 8, UR 3, NA 2 etc are assumed to be explicit instead of implicit, visible instead of invisible.When this distinction is not made then the Council is interpreted with an irrational premise. So the Council then emerges as a break with the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and the old ecclesiology.

It is hoped that Pope Francis will interpret Vatican Council II without the irrationality and so then the entire Church can accept Vatican Council II along with the old ecclesiology and without any strange innovations in theology.

The Vatican can simply do this by announcing that there are no exceptions in Vatican Council II to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.LG 16 is not an exception.

Pope Francis simply has to announce that there are no known exceptions in 2015 to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, so the Church's ecclesiology  has not changed, it is the same as the old ecclesiology of the SSPX.

The doctrinal issue has still not be touched by Pope Francis.He is waiting for the SSPX to come into the Church accepting Vatican Council II as a break with the old ecclesiology. Vatican Insider is not aware of this -Lionel Andrades
Let the pope announce that LG 16 is implicit for us so the SSPX can have canonical status

Church Militant TV has missed the point.The doctrinal issue has still not been touched by Pope Francis

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