Saturday, November 16, 2019

Most of the books on Vatican Council II should not be there in the public and pontifical libraries . They should be sent back to the publishers if it is possible.They use a false premise and inference and then conclude with various new theories.Fr. Hans Kung sj is an example. So is Cardinal Walter Kasper.Their books should be removed from the libraries for being deceptive or the writers innocently being in ignorance.

Most of the books on Vatican Council II should not be there in the public and pontifical libraries . They should be sent back to the publishers if it is possible.They use a false premise and inference and then conclude with various new theories.Fr. Hans Kung sj is an example. So is Cardinal Walter Kasper.Their books should be removed from the libraries for being deceptive or the writers innocently being in ignorance.
If a book was full of plagiarized passages  it would be removed. If books use a false premise, as a them and re-interpret Vatican Council II irrationally ( when a rational option is there),and then project all the new theories, as a new revelation or development, in the Catholic Church, it should not be there in the library.
Fr. Kung has been at this deception for 50 years. He has grown old and his understanding of Vatican Council II is outdated and unethical.-Lionel Andrades

We need new books to be written on Vatican Council II. It is a whole new field.

We need new books to be written on Vatican Council II. It is a whole new field.The Council only supports the Syllabus of Errors and Feeneyite extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) when it is interpreted rationally.So it has to be shown that  LG 8, LG 14, LG 16, UR 3, NA 2, GS 22 etc support the past exclusivist ecclesiology of the Catholic Church rejected by Cardinal Ratzinger and the liberal theologians. Though the new books on Vatican Council II could be considered Anti-Semitic and prosyltism, by the Jewish Left.The liberal cardinals and bishops would also oppose them.
The American and German bishops who support immigration could oppose  it since the new interpretation of the Council would indicate all non Catholic immigrants need faith and baptism(AG 7, LG 14) for salvation( to avoid Hell).
The new books on Vatican Council II would not say that outside the Church there is salvation.We now know there is no known salvation.There is no rupture with Tradition and the teachings on the Catholic Church having a superiority and exclusiveness in salvation. But Pope Francis would call Vatican Council II triumphalistic and prosyltism.
Catholics though would have got back their identity. They would learn the difference between Feeneyism and Cushingism, in the interpretation of all magisterial documents  and not just the Council.
Kasper, Koch, Ladaria and Ratzinger would be 'past tense'.
Morandi and Di Noia, the Secretaries of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith(CDF) would have to adapt to a new reality.
The new books on Vatican Council II would state what is common knowledge. LG 8, LG 14, LG 16 etc refer to invisible people in 2019. BOD, BOB and I.I. They refer to  unknown people in the present times. Nostra Aetate refers to speculative cases. The Council in general mentions hypothetical cases in UR 3, GS 22,LG 8, NA 2 etc. They cannot still be mistaken for examples of personally known non Catholics, saved outside the Catholic Church.
The norm for salvation is 'faith and baptism'(LG 14, AG 7). So when we meet non Catholics we know that they are oriented to Hell.The norm for salvation is not LG 8, LG 16, UR 3, NA 2 etc.
There is no extraordinary means of salvation for us human beings.Since if someone was saved outside the Church it would only be known to God. There are no exceptions to AG 7 , for us.So there is only the ordinary means of salvation, which is faith and the baptism of water(LG 14, AG 7).We cannot see a baptism of desire case and nor can we administer it.
Most people on earth are oriented to Hell according to Vatican Council II, since they die without faith and the baptism of water(AG 7, LG 14). So mission is needed knowing that most people on earth, are on the way to Hell unless they convert into the Catholic Church, with faith and the baptism of water.
Jews, Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists are outside the Church. So are atheists and Wiccans.
In Heaven there are only Catholics who are there with faith and the baptism of water.If there are good people from other religions who are also in Heaven, they would be Catholic, there.
They would have been baptized with water and God would have sent a preacher to them before they entered Heaven.
Catholics who commit suicide or die with un-repentant and un-Confessed mortal sins on their soul, also will go to Hell.They are outside the Church and should not receive the Eucharist at Holy Mass.  -Lionel Andrades

The New Evangelisation resource material is now out dated since it is based upon books which interpret Vatican Council II irrationally and have artificially created a rupture with the past ecclesiology.

The New Evangelisation resource material is now out dated since it is based upon books which interpret Vatican Council II irrationally  and  have artificially created a rupture with the past ecclesiology.
Archbishop Rino Fiscichella,  President of the Pontifical Council for the Promotion of the New Evangelisation, must make the change at the St. John Lateran University, Rome.He needs to list the books in the library, for example, which are now obsolete.Since they carry an error.
Cardinal Ratzinger and Cardinal Kasper's books on ecclesiology and Vatican Council II can no more be recommended reading . Similarly Dominus Iesus and Redemptoris Missio, which are Cushingite, need to be reviewed.-Lionel Andrades

The Franciscans of the Immaculate case is no more an issue, the groups simply have to meet and agree on a new version of Vatican Council II; a rational interpretation of the Council. The Council supports the past ecclesiology, an ecumenism of return and the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, associated with the Traditional Latin Mass, the Byzantine Greek Mass and the Church Fathers.

The Franciscans of the Immaculate case is no more an issue, the groups simply have to meet and agree on a new version of Vatican Council II; a rational interpretation of the Council. The Council supports the past ecclesiology, an ecumenism of return and the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, associated with the Traditional Latin Mass, the Byzantine Greek Mass and the Church Fathers.
Vatican Council II is no  more a rupture with the popes of the Middle Ages on salvation theology and doctrines.
Being 'crypto Lefebvre' is a non issue.Since the Lefebvrists themselves, have to ratify a new and rational interpretatiion of the Council.It is no more a rupture with Tradition( EENS, Syllabus of Errors, etc).-Lionel Andrades

Cardinal Kasper, Archbishop Bruno Forte and Bishop Semararo's books on ecclesiology, which are recommended reading for semesters in ecclesiology at the pontifical universities are now obsolete and need to be scrapped.

Cardinal Kasper, Archbishop Bruno Forte and Bishop Semararo's books on ecclesiology, which are recommended reading for semesters in ecclesiology at the pontifical universities are now obsolete and need to be scrapped.
Their ecclesiology was based upon speculative and unknown cases, mentioned in LG 8, LG 14, LG 16 etc in Vatican Council II, being known and literally seen non Catholics saved outside the Catholic Church. So in this way LG 8 etc, were projected as exceptions; practical exceptions, to Feeneyite extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) and the past exclusivist ecclesiology  of the Church.It's only with this 'trick' a rupture was created with St. Thomas Aquinas, St. Augustine and the Church Fathers on EENS.
Even the books on ecclesiology of Cardinal Ratzinger/ Pope Benedict  are based upon this objective error. It is a fact of life that we cannot see or meet non Catholics, saved in invincible ignorance(LG 16) or elements of sanctification and truth(LG 8) in other religions, or in imperfect communion with the Church(UR 3) as Protestants, Pentecostals or Orthodox Christians.-Lionel Andrades

Edward Pentin and Diane Montagna could ask Coetus International to clarify their statement

The anonymous Coetus International wrote their criticism of the Working Document of the Amazon Synod based upon the irrational interpretation of Vatican Council II. They used the common false premise.So they could not cite the Council in Ad Gentes 7 to support the  old exclusivist ecclesiology of the Catholic Church.
It was similar to Chris Ferrara's book, EWTN a Network Gone Wrong.Ferrara did not know that Vatican Council II contradicted the apologists at EWTN on Feeneyite extra ecclesiam nulla salus and the traditional ecumenism of return.

Edward Pentin and Diane Montagna among the other journalists who posted that statement by Coetus Int'l, could ask them for a clarification.
Coetus cited Dominus Iesus 14 and 16 which is Christological and not ecclesiocentric against the Working Document rejecting exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church.
This was a mistake. It was wrong to cite a Christological passage to counter a point which rejected exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church. 
Since with the New Theology ( based upon visible cases of LG 8, LG 16, UR 3 etc) , Cardinals Hummes, Kasper and Ladaria could say that the Amazonians are saved in their pagan religions, through Jesus and the Church. This was the New Theology of Pope Benedict too.
So Pope Benedict would conclude that the Amazonians in the jungle do not need to convert into the Catholic Church for salvation. They could be saved in invincible ignorance in their religion, through Jesus and the Church.He would cite Vatican Council II interpreted irrationally, with Cushingism.
Upon this reasoning was also based Pope Francis' Abu Dhabi Declaration.So exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church is now obsolete for the present two popes and the Left.
Similarly Bishop Robert Barron and the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops' Doctrinal and Evangelisation Committees, interpret Vatican Council II irrationally and there can be no comment from Coetus, since they use the same irrational reasoning. The traditionalists, however, use the irrational reasoning of the modernists to interpret the Council, but reject the Council.While the liberals accept the Council with the error.
The journalists who accepted and published the anonymous statement of Coetus, could ask them to explain themself on this issue.I have mentioned this before.
-Lionel Andrades

Repost : Michael Sean Winters affirms Vatican Council II and also the strict interpretation of extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) since the Council supports Feeneyite EENS when it is interpreted rationally.The Council is Feeneyite.He agrees with me.When he supports Fr. Leonard Feeney on EENS he is not in schism since the Council does the same when interpreted rationally.

November 3, 2019

Michael Sean Winters affirms Vatican Council II and also the strict interpretation of extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) since the Council supports Feeneyite EENS when it is interpreted rationally.The Council is Feeneyite.He agrees with me.When he supports Fr. Leonard Feeney on EENS he is not in schism since the Council does the same when interpreted rationally.

Michael Sean Winters affirms Vatican Council II and also the strict interpretation of extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) since the Council supports Feeneyite EENS when it is interpreted rationally.The Council is Feeneyite.He agrees with me.When he supports Fr. Leonard Feeney on EENS  he is not in schism since the Council does the same when interpreted rationally.
Image result for Photo Michael Sean Winters
The political correspondent of the National Catholic Reporter, Winters, like the correspondents of the Tablet, Commonweal, National Catholic Reporter and Crux agrees with me. No denials. No objections.


Winter was misled. Since Pope Paul VI  could have interpreted the Council in harmony with Feeneyite EENS if he wanted to.
LG 8,LG 14, LG 16, UR 3, NS 2, GS 22 etc are not 'physical bodies', real people in Newton's time and space.They do not exist in our reality in 2019.So whatever arguments are presented at the intellectual level to suggest there are exceptions to EENS, it is now known by the liberals and traditionalists, that there cannot be exceptions.All who are saved are in Heaven .They cannot be seen on earth.
So when it is mentioned that Congar, Rahner, Ratzinger, Bea, Cushing and Murray were active at the Council , it makes no difference.There are no exceptions  to Feeneyite EENS. There can be no exceptions.
Even if all who are saved are saved through Jesus and the Church(CCC 846) and the true Church of Christ subsists, outside the visible boundaries of the Church(LG 8), these are not reference to exceptions to EENS. There are no physical exceptions to 16th century EENS. This is the reality on the ground.So Winters cannot present a contrary theology or argument to contradict me.
Even if there are elements of sanctification and truth in other religions(LG 8) and there is that one ray of Truth enlightens all men and women in other religions(NA 2),there can be no physical example of salvation outside the Catholic Church. So the dogma EENS is not contradicted. We still have the old ecclesiology and and exclusive salvation in only the Catholic Church according to Vatican Council II.Ad Gentes 7 says all need faith and baptism. The Councl is ecclesiocentric here. Ad Gentes 7 is cited in the Catechism of the Catholic Church under the title No Salvation Outside the Church(CCC 846).
So for Michael Sean Winters there can only be y Catholics in Heaven, since he chooses to affirm Vatican Council II rationally, and not go into schism.We humans cannot know any exception to Feeneyite EENS.
Fr.John Zuhlsdorf can now inform Michael Sean Winters that it is he, Winters, who supports Fr. Leonard Feeney on EENS. Winters would accuse different conservatives of being Feeneyites. When he would lose an argument he would immediately mention Fr. Feeney, even when there was no connection to the subject being discussed. Now the tables are turned.
Winters  was accusing the traditionalists of being in schism  and he appealed to the U.S bishops to do something about it.Now he does not deny that he affirms Feeneyite EENS in harmony with Vatican Council II ( Feeneyite). His former interpretation of Vatican Council II, the Cushingite one, was irrational and it was the same interpretation of the traditionalists, whom he considered schismatic.
Welcome to the conservative camp, Michael.-Lionel Andrades




AUGUST 27, 2019


With Vatican Council II (Cushingite) there is a 'new revelation' in the Catholic Church.This liberal reading causes the hermeneutic of rupture with the past. It is obsolete since it is based upon an irrationality. A rational Feeneyite version is available


SEPTEMBER 3, 2019

Conservatives are still on the defensive and allow the National Catholic Reporter to quote Vatican Council II with an irrationality, a false premise.Catholics do not correct the NCR and affirm the Council rationally in harmony with Tradition ( Syllabus of Errors, Athanasius Creed, EENS etc).

SEPTEMBER 3, 2019

When the National Catholic Reporter quotes Vatican Council II the attack is always on extra ecclesiam nulla salus conservatives must remember.They have to quote the Council irrationally to condemn EENS, the past exclusivist ecclesiology and an ecumenism of return.

AUGUST 27, 2019

The liberal reading of Vatican Council II is finished but Michael Sean Winters persists
SEPTEMBER 3, 2019

U.S Bishops should address the issue of schism in the Catholic Church created with the interpretation of magisterial documents with irrational Cushingism, especially Vatican Council II  https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/08/us-bishops-should-address-issue-of.html
















NOVEMBER 23, 2018

Image result for Photo of Pope Francis latest
Should not the cardinals and bishops also interpret BOD, BOB and I.I rationally and set an example for the pope?  https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/11/should-not-cardinals-and-bishops-also.html

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JANUARY 28, 2015

Fr.Marco Hausmann , Fr.P. Stefano Visintin OSB say there are no exceptions to the dogma, Cardinal Valliani's Vicariate says there are  http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2015/01/frmarco-hausmann-fssp-frp-stefano.html

AUGUST 24, 2019
Image result for gPhotos Massimo faggioliImage result for gPhotos Michael Sean Winters 
Masimo Faggioli, Michael Sean Winters interpret Vatican Council II with Cushingism instead of Feeneyism and justify so many changes in the Church  https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/08/masimo-faggioli-michael-sean-winters.html
 AUGUST 22, 2019
Massimo Faggioli and Michael Sean Winters interpret Vatican Council II with Cushingism instead of Feeneyism and so do not correct the error made by Pope Paul VI. They also interpret extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) with Cushingism instead of Feeneyism and so do not correct the error made by Pope John XXIII  https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/08/massimo-faggioli-and-michael-sean.html
AUGUST 22, 2019
Massimo Faggioli, Michael Sean Winters and the other Cushingites support heresy when they reject the Athanasius Creed , change the interpretation of the Nicene and Apostles Creed, change the interpretation of Vatican Council II and all the Catechisms and reject traditional extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS ) based upon rational Feeneyism.They are in a general rupture with the past Magisterium, when they use Cushingism as a philosophy and theology https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/08/massimo-faggioli-michael-sean-winters.html

AUGUST 22, 2019
Image result for Photos disobedientLiberals tell traditionalists that they are disobedient to this liberal pope and to Vatican Council II(Cushingite).It is the liberals and the present two popes who must be asked to follow Vatican Council II (Feeneyite) and accept its conclusions.Do not interpret the Council with an irrational premise and then expect the whole Church to follow. It is Vatican Council II(Feeneyite) which the disobedient liberals reject. Since it is in harmony with the Syllabus of Errors, Athanasius Creed, the past exclusivist ecclesiology and an ecumenism of return
AUGUST 26, 2019
Feeneyites accept Vatican Council II. They accept that the baptism of desire(BOD), baptism of blood(BOB) and invincible ignorance(I.I) can only be hypothetical cases. They affirm the strict interpretation of extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) which is not contradicted by hypothetical cases of LG 8, UR 3, GS 22 etc.

Massimo Faggioli and Michael Sean Winters are no more churning out the same stale stuff on Vatican Council II.This is too much for them.They were not expecting this U-turn on the Council , suddenly after 50 years.

Massimo Faggioli and Michael Sean Winters are no more churning out the same stale stuff on Vatican Council II.Catholics have discovered an intepretation of the Council, which is rational and traditional.It has  the hermeneutic of continuity with the past ecclesiology, the traditional ecumenism of return and Feeneyite extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS).This is too much for them.They were not expecting this U-turn on the Council , suddenly after 50 years.
Now when Pope Francis says new things, he cannot honestly cite Vatican Council II. We can accept it as  his personal opinion and innovation since the Council is traditional and in harmony with the past. This is the Tradition  which he rejects, as do the Masons and the rest of the Left.
The Society of St. Pius X(SSPX) and the sedevacantists no more have to reject the Council but simply adapt to the 'new' rational interpretation. Faggioli and Winters' 'old' interpretation of the Council is now obsolete.-Lionel Andrades

Clearer Vatican II vision by Paul Lakeland uses an outdated theology : the Catholic Church has moved forward

Clearer Vatican II vision


A large crowd is seen in St. Peter's Square as Pope Francis celebrates the canonization Mass for Sts. John XXIII and John Paul II at the Vatican April 27, 2014. (CNS/Reuters/Stefano Rellandini)

THE VISION OF VATICAN II: ITS FUNDAMENTAL PRINCIPLES
By Ormond Rush
624 pages; Published by Liturgical Press
$69.95
"People of God," "sensus fidelium," "signs of the times," these phrases and more are the slogans by which most of us know something, if anything, about the achievements of the Second Vatican Council. It is rare that those of us who are not professional theologians or ecclesiologists go deeper into the documents where these phrases first appear and especially into the background history out of which the documents themselves emerged.
Lionel: At the onset let me say that the writer has made a mistake. He has interpreted Vatican Council II with Cushingism instead of Feeneyism. He has used an irrational premise to project the Council as a rupture with Tradition( EENS, Syllabus of Errors etc).
The Council is Feeneyite without the false premise used by the writer, innocently.
______________________________

With the appearance of Ormond Rush's new book, we no longer have an excuse for settling with a superficial grasp of the overall meaning of the council. A distinguished Australian theologian, Rush is well-known in academic circles for his influential books on the interpretation of Vatican II. His previous book, The Eyes of Faith, examined how the Holy Spirit enlightens the "supernatural sense of the faithful."

Now in his new book, Rush engages academic theologians in a deep analysis of the conciliar texts while presenting the complexity of the Vatican council in a way that is also enormously rewarding to less professional readers.
 Lionel: The Council would continue to be complex and contradictory for readers since a false premise and inference is used to interpret the Council.
________________________


Theologians have for the most part taken sides in the reform versus "reform of the reform" that has dominated discussion of the council for the past 20 years.
 Lionel: Both sides are using a false premise to interpret the Council to create an artificial rupture with Tradition.
________________________

 Non-specialists who are aware of the council's importance to the shape of the church today may bemoan its consequent captivity to mindless liberalism or — in the case of the majority of NCR readers — wait longingly for the full implementation of the council's vision.
 Lionel: Mindless liberalism is an apt description. Hypothetical and speculative references in the Council were interpreted as being personally known non Catholics saved outside the Church. This became the basis for the New Theology and the irrational and common false interpretation of the Council.
_________________________

 This is, of course, the "popular" version of the academic debate. Both groups will benefit from paying close attention to Rush's method and to the insights it generates.
There are three important organizing ideas that shape this huge book. First, the 24 "fundamental principles" into which Rush divides the work are organized into three groups: hermeneutical, theological and ecclesiological.
 Lionel: In principle the Council Fathers assumed unknown people were known exceptions to the past ecclesiology. This is theme in the Council. It is irrational. The conclusion is non traditional and creates what Pope Benedict called the hermeneutic of rupture with the past.
_________________________

Second, the author is insistent that the council needs to be seen more as a theological event than, as it is so often treated, as an ecclesiological event.
 Lionel: Yes it was a major theological error. A disaster which is historical.It is not Catholic. The approach was unethical and the lie is still being maintained by those who are in a capacity to correct the mistake of the Council Fathers.
_________________________

 Put better, perhaps, its reforming vision of the church is in the service of the event of God's self-revelation in Jesus Christ. Or a little more tersely, it makes the point that the church exists not for its own sake but for the sake of the Gospel.
 Lionel: With the false premise and inference false exceptions are created to reject the traditional understanding of the Gospel.
_________________________

The third principle, which may seem in some respects to cut against the second, is Rush's commitment to understanding Vatican II as a pastoral council. The claim that Vatican II was "merely pastoral" is a standard statement of those who wish to play down its significance, while Rush's point is that it is pastoral precisely because the weight of its theological teaching intends the health of the community of faith.
 Lionel: It is pastoral based upon a false theology.With a false premise and inference it has rejected the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS). Without this error the Council even today can be interpreted in harmony with Feeneyite EENS.But this is out of the scope of the author.
________________________

Anything that brings alive to believers the action of God in history is both pastoral and theological, and even pastoral because it is theological. Otherwise, it may just be fluff.
Lionel : With the New Theology based upon Cushingite BOD,BOB and I.I and Cushingite EENS, we have fluff.
With Feeneyite BOD,BOB and I.I and Feeneyite EENS we have a Council which is traditional and rational.
________________________

To make the case for the priority of theology over ecclesiology, Rush begins with the revelation/faith duo, which focuses on Dei Verbum, but goes beyond it. Correctly, since while it is one of the shorter conciliar documents, Dei Verbum is one of only two that were classified by the council fathers as a "dogmatic constitution," the highest grade of the 16 documents, so to speak. The way in which Rush addresses this key text models his approach to all the council documents and to the lengthy discussions of each of the principles.
In the first instance, Dei Verbum makes sense only when we know something of the background history of what has often been called the "two sources" understanding of revelation. Rush makes clear what was at stake when the draft document reflected an influential but erroneous understanding of the Catholic position, and clearly illustrates the debate and wrangling that took place in the struggle to reach a better understanding. The importance of Dei Verbum is that it locates revelation not as a series of scriptural or dogmatic statements, but as the event of the self-revelation of God in Jesus Christ, to which Scripture and tradition in their different ways testify.
 Lionel: Dei Verbum accepts one final revelation of Jesus Christ. With the false premise creating exceptions to the dogma EENS, which is based on Scripture, we have a new revelation in Vatican Council II. A new revelation  which is a false interpretation based upon irrational and innovative reasoning. 
_____________________________

The method by which Rush handles the discussion of faith and revelation is continued throughout the many ensuing discussions. The two terms that identify a particular pairing, "faith and history" or "people of God and hierarchy" or "church and world," for example, are never presented as opposites. Rather, they are complementary ideas that show the complexity and richness of the conciliar texts.
Like the council itself, the documents are not the final word on anything, and they leave much unsaid and much work to be done.
 Lionel: The author needs to write another book on Vatican Council II in which he does not mix up what is invisible as being visible. Then he will discover that the Council is Feeneyite and not Cushingite. It is traditional and not liberal. This would be a disappointment for the readers of the National Catholic Reporter.Vatican Council II would support the past ecclesiology of the Traditional Latin Mass.
___________________________________________

 The council for Rush is a work in progress, and the dynamism of ecclesial life, as it was at the time of the council, continues to be the place where a fuller appreciation of the work of the council will become apparent. Development and change are all over this fine book, though neither word appears in the title of any of the 24 principles that make it up. These ideas, as John Courtney Murray made clear, were at the heart of the council's work, and recognizing this explains the extent of the conservative backlash to at least some of the documents.
 Lionel: Murray was a Cushingite like Cardinal Cushing who was also there at the Council and had still not lifted the excommunication of Fr.Leonard Feeney.Now we know that we can interpret the Council in line with Fr. Leonard Feeney's traditional concept of outside the Church there is no  salvation. So much of Murray's work was in vain. 
______________________________________

 Rush is entirely in agreement with Murray's judgment, but his book may go to show more clearly, with the benefit of more than 50 years of subsequent history, that the inevitability of change was not so much enshrined in the conciliar documents as it was proclaimed as a vital theological and ecclesial principle going forward.

web 20120928nw1694.jpg


Pope John XXIII leads the opening session of the Second Vatican Council in St. Peter's Basilica at the Vatican Oct. 11, 1962. (CNS/Catholic Press Photo/Giancarlo Giuliani) 
This book is recommended to anyone who struggles to understand the meaning of the Second Vatican Council and who is not enlightened by the polarized antagonisms of recent decades. It is a long book, admirably clear in the way it approaches sometimes complex issues, and rewards the reader from its first word to its last.
Lionel: I would not recommend it. It's theology is outdated.We now have a rational and 'new' understanding of the Council. Future books on Vatican Council II are excepted to reflect this change.
__________________________________
As Rush concludes, all these principles he has discussed at length intermingle with all the others, and that may be a relief to the reader with limited time. There is a tight structure to the book, but not one that requires the reader to start at the beginning and go on to the end. You really can dip in and out. You will not get the whole story, but you will get the point. And honestly, in the end, the point is to rekindle a genuine sense of excitement at what the council continues to mean for the church.
Lionel. It is what the Council continues to mean for the liberals, who do not know, or want to accept, that their interpretation is obsolete.
-Lionel Andrades
[Paul Lakeland is the Aloysius P. Kelley S.J. Professor of Catholic Studies and director of the Center for Catholic Studies at Fairfield University.]
 https://www.ncronline.org/news/opinion/clearer-vatican-ii-vision



 TERMS CLARIFIED 

 BOD( Baptism of Desire . Case of the unknown cathechumen who desires the baptism of water but dies before he receives it and is allegedly saved and now in Heaven)

BOB (Baptism of Blood. The case of unknown person who is in Heaven as a martyr without the baptism of water)



I.I (Invincible ignorance: The case of an unknown non Catholics who is in Heaven without faith and baptism and instead in invincible ignorance.)



LG 8 ( Lumen Gentium 8: The case of the unknown person saved outside the Church with 'elements of sanctification and truth' or where the true Church of Christ allegedly subsists.


 LG 14 (Lumen Gentium 14:  Baptism of Desire . Case of the unknown cathechumen who desires the baptism of water but dies before he receives it and is allegedly saved and now in Heaven)


LG 16 ( Lumen Gentium 16: The case of the unknown person saved outside the Church in invincible ignorance and who is now in Heaven without faith and the baptism of water) 


UR 3 (Unitatitis Redintigratiio 3, Vatican Council II : The case of the unknown Christian, who is saved in his religions without Catholic faith or the baptism of water in the Catholic Church and is allegedly known to someone on earth who has seen him or her in Heaven).

NA 2(  Nostra Aetate 2: The case of  the unknown non Catholic saved outside the Catholic Church without faith and baptism. He or she is saved with good and holy things in other religion or with the a ray of that Truth which enlightens all mankind.

GS 22 (Gaudium et Specs 22. The case of the unknown non Catholic who is saved outside the Catholic Church. He or she is saved without faith and baptism but with goodwill.

November 11, 2019

 Cover for 9780199593255Cover for 9780198709763Cover for 9780199659272Cover for 9780198717522Cover for 9780195332674

 


The Oxford University Press has produced many books on Vatican Council II based upon a false premise. A deceptive rupture is created with Catholic Tradition

 https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/11/the-oxford-university-press-has.html

 

 

EXAMPLES OF THE HYPOTHETICAL REFERENCES IN THE CATECHISM FOR THEM WHICH ARE NOT HYPOTHETICAL.
1. 'God is not limited to the Sacraments'(CCC 1257)
'2.all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body'(CC(CCC 846).
3. Those 'justified by faith in Baptism are incorporated into Christ; they therefore have a right to be called Christians'(CCC 818).
4. They are 'joined in many ways to the baptized who are honored by the name of Christian, but do not profess the Catholic faith in its entirety or have not preserved unity or communion under the successor of Peter."(CCC 838).
5. 'the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims'(CCC 841).




__________________________________



EXAMPLES OF HYPOTHETICAL REFERENCES IN VATICAN COUNCIL II FOR THEM WHICH ARE NOT HYPOTHETICAL.
1. 'elements of sanctification and truth'in other religions(LG 8),
2..'good and holy' things in other religions(NA 2),
3..'a ray of that Truth which enlightens' all men(NA 2),
4.'imperfect communion with the Church(UR 3),
5.' people of good will in other religions'(GS 22),
6.' seeds of the Word'(AG 11),
7.'invincible ignorance'(LG 16),
8.'a good conscience'(LG 16) etc.


 HYPOTHETICAL REFERENCES IN THE LETTER OF THE HOLY OFFICE 1949 TO THE ARCHBISHOP O
OF BOSTON WHICH FOR THEM ARE NOT HYPOTHETICAL.
1.Therefore, no one will be saved who, knowing the Church to have been divinely established by Christ, nevertheless refuses to submit to the Church or withholds obedience from the Roman Pontiff, the Vicar of Christ on earth.(We do not know who this person is in particular so it is a hypothetical case.)
2.In His infinite mercy God has willed that the effects, necessary for one to be saved, of those helps to salvation which are directed toward man's final end, not by intrinsic necessity, but only by divine institution, can also be obtained in certain circumstances when those helps are used only in desire and longing.(We do not know any one in particular as such so this is a hypothetical case.)
3.Therefore, that one may obtain eternal salvation, it is not always required that he be incorporated into the Church actually as a member, but it is necessary that at least he be united to her by desire and longing.( If there is any such person he or she would only be known to God. So this passage is irrelevant to the dogma EENS. It cannot be an exception.Since it is a reference to an invisible person for us.)
4.However, this desire need not always be explicit, as it is in catechumens; but when a person is involved in invincible ignorance God accepts also an implicit desire, so called because it is included in that good disposition of soul whereby a person wishes his will to be conformed to the will of God.(This is a reference to an unknown catechumen)


 5.For in this letter the Sovereign Pontiff clearly distinguishes between those who are actually incorporated into the Church as members, and those who are united to the Church only by desire.( Again we have a theoretical and hypothetical reference. We do not know who is united to the Church only in desire and will be saved.) -Lionel Andrades

JANUARY 25, 2018








Traditionalists cannot tell Faggioli Vatican Council II can be interpreted in harmony with the past ecclesiology of the Church. This is unknown or unthinkable.

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/01/traditionalists-cannot-tell-faggioli.html

 










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OCTOBER 19, 2017


Screen Shot 2017-10-06 at 11.49.39


And Faggioli and the rest get away with it once again

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/10/and-faggioli-and-rest-get-away-with-it.html


 OCTOBER 8, 2017

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/10/massimo-faggioli-and-cardinal-burke.html

TERMS EXPLAINED

Feeneyism: It is the old theology and philosophical reasoning which says there are no known exceptions past or present, to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS).There are no explicit cases to contradict the traditional interpretation of EENS.It affirms traditional EENS like the missionaries and magisterium of the 16th century.
Cushingism: It is the new theology and philosophical reasoning, which assumes there are known exceptions, past and present, to the dogma EENS.There are exceptions to all needing to be incorporated into the Church for salvation.It wronly assumes that the baptism of desire etc are not hypothetical but objectively known.In principle hypothetical cases are objective in the present times.So it uses the false premise to reject the traditional interpretation of EENS.
Irrational premise: It is assuming hypothetical cases are not hypothetical but instead are objective cases in the present times.
It assumes invisible and unknown people are visible and unknown in our reality.
Baptism of Desire ( premise-free): It refers to the hypothetical case of an unknown catechumen who desires the baptism of water but dies before he receives it and is saved. Since this is an invisible case in our reality it, the baptism of desire, is not relevant to the dogma EENS.
Baptism of Desire (with the false premise): It refers to the known case of a catechumen who desires the baptism of water but dies before he receives it and is saved.A known person is assumed to be known.
Invincible Ignorance ( premise-free): This refers to the hypothetical case of someone allegedly saved without the baptism of water in the Catholic Church, since he was in ignorance.Since it is a hypothetical case it is not an exception to the dogma EENS.The false premise was not used.
Invincible Ignorance (with the false premise): This refers to the explicit case of someone allegedly saved without the baptism of water in the Catholic Church, since he was in ignorance.Since it is an exception to the dogma EENS it is assumed to be objectively known in particular cases.This reasoning is irrational.
Council of Florence: One of the three Councils which defined the dogma EENS.It did not mention any exception.It did not mention the baptism of desire. It was premise-free.
Liberal theologians: They re-interpreted the baptism of desire and being saved in invincible ignorance, as objective cases, known in the present times.They used the false premise.

Vatican Council II (with the premise):
 It refers to the interpretation of Vatican Council II without the false premise.LG 16, LG 8, UR 3, NA 2 etc refer not to hypothetical but known cases in the present times. So Vatican Council II emerges as a break with the dogma EENS.
Vatican Council II ( premise-free):It refers to the interpretation of Vatican Council II without the false premise.LG 16, LG 8, UR 3, NA 2 etc refer to hypothetical cases, which are unknown personally in the present times.So Vatican Council II is not a break with EENS, the Syllabus of Errors, ecumenism of return, the Nicene Creed ( premise-free),the teaching on the Social Reign of Christ the King over all political legislation and the non separation of Church and State( since all need to convert into the Church to avoid Hell).

Letter of the Holy Office 1949 to the Archbishop of Boston:(with the false premise)
 It assumed hypothetical cases were defacto known in the present times. So it presented the baptism of desire etc as an explicit exception, to the traditional interpretation of the dogma EENS.It censured Fr.Leonard Feeney and the St.Benedict Center.Since they did not assume that the baptism of desire referred to a visible instead of invisible case.The Letter made the baptism of desire etc relevant to EENs.From the second part of this Letter has emerged the New Theology.It used the false premise.
Letter of the Holy Office 1949 ( premise-free). It means interpreting the first part of the  the Letter without the false premise.Only the first part.It supports Fr. Leonard Feeney of Boston.The traditional interpretatiion of the dogma EENS does not mention any exceptions.However the second part of the Letter contradicts the first part since it uses the false premise.
Letter of the Holy Office ( with the false premise).The second part of the Letter rejects the traditional interpretation of EENS. Since it considers the baptism of desire ( with the premise) and being saved in invincible ignorance ( with the premise) as being exceptions to EENS (premise-free). In other words they are mistaken for being visible and known cases when they really are invisible for us.It wrongly assumes hypothetical cases are objectively visible and so they are exceptions to the first part of the Letter.
Baltimore Catechism: It assumed that the desire for the baptism of an unknown catechumen, who dies before receiving it and was saved, was a baptism like the baptism of water. So it was placed in the Baptism Section of the catechism. In other words it was wrongly assumed that the baptism of desire is visible and repeatable like the baptism of water or that we can administer it like the baptism of water.The Baltimore Catechism is accepted with the confusion.It can be interpreted premise-free.
Catechism of Pope X: It followed the Baltimore Catechism and placed the baptism of desire in the Baptism Section.It can be interpreted as being premise -free. The references to invincible ignorance etc have to be interpreted without the false premise. So it does not contradict the dogma EENS( premise-free).
Nicene Creed ( with the premise): It says 'I believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sins' and means there are more than three known baptisms when the false premise is used in the interpretation. They are water, blood, desire, seeds of the Word etc.This is an irrational but common understanding.
Nicene Creed ( premise-free): It says 'I believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sins and means there is one known baptism the baptism of water.

New Theology: : (with the premise) It refers to the new theology in the Catholic Church based on hypothetical cases being objective in the present times.So it eliminates the dogma EENS.With the dogma EENS made obsolete the ecclesiology of the Church changes. There is a new ecclesiology which is a break with Tradition.It is of course based on the false premise.
Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus ( with the false premise).It refers to the dogma but with exceptions.All do not need to defacto convert into the Church in the present times, since there are exceptions.The baptism of desire( with the premise), baptism of blood( with the premise) and being saved in invincible ignorance( with the premise) are exceptions to dogma as it was known to the missionaries in the 16th century.
Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus ( premise-free): It refers to the dogma as it was interpreted over the centuries.There are no known exceptions to all needing to formally enter the Church, with faith and baptism, to avoid Hell.Invisible for us baptism of desire, baptism of blood and being saved in invincible ignorance are not visible exceptions to all needing to be incorporated into the Catholic Church for salvation.
Catechism of the Catholic Church ( with the premise): CCC 1257 contradicts the Principle of Non Contraduction. Also CCC 848 is based on the new theology and so is a rupture with the dogma EENS( premise-free). So this is an interpretation of the Catechism with the false premise.
Catechism of the Catholic Church ( premise-free): CCC 1257 does not contradict the Principle of Non Contradiction since there are no known exceptions to all needing the baptism of water for salvation. There are no known cases in the present times of God not being not limited to the Sacraments(CCC1257).
When CCC 846 states all who are saved are saved through Jesus and the Church,CCC 846 does not contradict the dogmatic teaching on all needing to formally enter the Church.It is a reference to a hypothetical case and not somebody known. CCC 846 does not contradict Ad Gentes 7 which states all need faith and baptism for salvation.
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