Friday, February 15, 2013

ELEVENTH HOUR RECONCILIATION WITH THE SSPX POSSIBLE

At the 11th hour the Society of St.Pius X (SSPX) can still seek a reconciliation with the Vatican by calling for an agreement on three points of Catholic doctrine. On February 22 they can just meet to agree on three points and then make an announcement.

The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith has sent a letter with a final offer to the Society of Saint Pius X (FSSPX / SSPX): resume the dialogue with the Holy See by February 22,2013 according to Rorate Caeili.

The SSPX should welcome the offer as an opportunity to clarify a very important point regarding Vatican Council II which is that the text of the Council is traditional without the error of the dead man walking.

The dead man walking theory being used by the Vatican in the interpretation of Vatican Council II is assuming all salvation mention in the Council refers to cases now in Heaven and which are visible in the present times on earth. They can allegedly see the dead saved in Heaven now walking on earth.

So in a meeting on Feb.22 they can agree

1. There is no case of implicit to us salvation which is physically visible to us on earth.

2.So Lumen Gentium 16 (invincible ignorance etc) does not contradict Ad Gentes 7 which says all need faith and baptism for salvation.

3.Vatican Council II (LG 16,LG 8,UR 3 etc) does not contradict Ad Gentes 7, the thrice defined dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and the SSPX's traditional position on other religions and ecumenism.

This could be the basis for reveiwing religious liberty in Dignitatis Humanae.

It's as simple as that.
-Lionel Andrades

VATICAN NOT SINCERE IN SEEKING A DOCTRINAL SOLUTION WITH THE SSPX

HOW LONG MORE BEFORE THE VATICAN OPENLY APPROVES ABORTION AND HOMOSEXUALITY ?

Archbishop Muller and Di Noia identify the premise of the visible dead in the interpretation of Vatican Council II

Archbishop Di Noia's the Church is always right is becoming controversial: How can the Holy Spirit say that we can see the deceased saved?

EDWARD PENTIN DID NOT ASK ARCHBISHOPS MULLER AND DI NOI HOW COULD INVINCIBLE IGNORANCE AND 'ELEMENTS OF GRACE' BE EXCEPTIONS TO EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS

Archbishop Augustine Di Noia says the Holy Spirit preserves the Church from error including the interpretation of Vatican Council II- we now know there are two interpretations of Vatican Council II, which one is guided by the Holy Spirit ?

It is the responsibility of the CDF to clarify doctrine and the Faith and so they should answer the two questions for all to know

Vatican-SSPX reconciliation is possible just by announcing that the baptism of desire does not contradict the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus

INVINCIBLE IGNORANCE IS NOT OBSERVABLE TO US AT ALL-Donald E.Flood

Of course, as we know, "invincible ignorance" is not salvific! How could "not knowing" something save anyone??? Those who are in "invincible ignorance" can be saved in only a limited number of scenarios:

1) The One and Triune God delivers a person from his/her "invincibly ignorant" state; that person receives Christian Baptism, and is by that very fact, visibly joined to the Catholic Church, assuming, of course, that his/her Baptism, in addition to being valid, was also "fruitful".
Donald Flood's profile photo

Scenario 1 is observable to us, at least in part.

2) The "invincible ignorant" person receives salutary repentance at death's door.

Scenario 2 is not observable to us.

3) The "invincibly ignorant" person was, unknown to him/her, validly baptized in his/her infancy, and by that very fact, was explicitly joined to the Catholic Church.

Scenario 3 is not observable to us, unless we were the ones baptizing the person and/or being a witness to that.

4) The "invincibly ignorant" person was, known to him/her, validly baptized in his/her infancy, and by that very fact, was explicitly joined to the Catholic Church, but as an adult, does not profess the Catholic Faith.

Scenario 4 is not observable to us, as we cannot tell if the person in question is in a state of mortal sin.

5) The "invincibly ignorant" person has perfect charity of the Creator of the Universe along with supernatural faith in Him, but for whatever reason, the One and Triune God does not deliver that person from his/her "invincibly ignorant" state.

Scenario 5 is not observable to us at all..

CATHOLIC FORUM IN AUSTRALIA CLAIMS LETTER OF THE HOLY OFFICE 1949 MADE AN ERROR


The star member of the True Catholic forum is a retired priest from Australia Fr.John George.In the past some of my reports were pulled down (1) and there was a general ban on the subject extra ecclesiam nulla salus on True Catholic.Also extra ecclesiam nulla salus has been banned on the other Catholic forums in Australia, like Thy Daily Bread. Probably they have received legal threats under leftists laws in Australia.

Fr.John George knows there is no visible baptism of desire and being saved in invincible ignorance.Yet he will not admit this on the forum.Since it would mean he is affirming the literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.If he supports the literal interpretation there could be threats under anti Semitism and racist laws .The members of True Catholic now hold non Catholic positions on this subject except for a member Trent.They claim that Jews do not have to convert into the Catholic Church for salvation.

Meanwhile on other subjects Fr.John George maintains an orthodox Catholic position and still regularly criticizes the dissenting Australian website Catholica. True Catholic itself however has begum to dissent on the Church teaching on salvation.

To maintain their non traditional position on salvation Fr.John George says, like the Left, that the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 condemned Fr.Leonard Feeney for holding the rigorist interpretation of the dogma i.e he denied the baptism of desire etc.

Fr.John George is implying that the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 made a mistake and assumed that the baptism of desire etc was physically visible and so an exception to the dogma on salvation.This is false.The Letter of the Holy Office 1949 no where states that being saved in invincible ignroance or with implicit desire is physically visible to us or, that it is an exception to the dogma on salvation.

The priest from Sydney and the Administrator are trying to protect themself by changing the teachings of the Cathlic Church with irrationality and non traditional views.-Lionel Andrades

1.
Note: One of my posts on evolution which said the ape could have devolved from man, a degenerate species and thatscientists cannot disprove this view was found distrubing by the leftists and the post was removed.

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Posted by Trent on February 3, 2013, 12:51 am
124.179.239.13
I notice all three of you attack me personally and never try to counter the points that are made in my posts. Fr John George admits he was a Liberal priest in his early years and still is blindsided by Liberalism allthough he appears orthodox in some areas. PDH must be a typical Protestant convert by the protestant ardour he holds to Vatican II and seems to have no clue that the Catholic Church has been around for 2,000 years without the major change foisted upon Catholics by John XXIII, Paul VI, JP 2 and currently Benedict XVI who are not Orthodox but Liberal and Progressive in their outlook whilst trying to pretend they are Conservative.

Each of them took the Oath against Modernism but each of them abide by "the New Theology" as espoused by other high standing "Churchmen" such as Karl Rahner, Henri du Lubac, Hans Kung, Hans von Balthsar and many others Progressives.

Benedict does not believe in the Ressurection of our bodies at the end time and, without any explanation, says "persons" may be resurrected even though in the Aposotle Creed we have prayed for the resurrection of the body as part of our Faith.

The Catholic Church "is" the Mystical Body of Christ. It does not "subsist" as was recommended by a protestant minister to Benedict who mentioned this to Cardinal Frings and they adopted that wording.

There is only one Church that can provide Salvation and that is the Catholic Church whose tenets must be held inviolate by the Faithful

If I am wrong in my deliberations, why don't you take each point you don't agree with and explain where I am wrong in the articles I post???

If you really think I am wrong in my assumptions regarding the True Catholic Faith, why don't you go through my posts and refute my beliefs with good and sound principles instead of personal attacks. That would be the course a True Catholic would take, if you think I am seeing things that are wrong in your eyes. That would be the Catholic Way to help those whom you think have got the Faith wrong!!

I don't attack any of you but if you are True Catholics you should want to point out in detail where I am wrong as that is what a true Catholic would do. Don't attack me personally but prove to me I am mistaken in maintaining the Faith of my parents, grandparents and the Priests, Nuns and Christian Brothers who formed my Faith before the Vatican II revolution which, in my opinion, has negatively affected the Faith of many millions of Catholics who accept contraception, abortion, same-sex marriage and gross immodesty in dress and morals since Vatican II

Even Popes like JP II allowed extremely immodestly dressed women and men to perform in front of them with the briefest of costumes like high cut tights up to their hip bones that expose their flesh up to their hips and showing, in intimate and immodest poses the shapes of their pubic areas and their bottoms as the tights became caught up their bottoms showing off and almost nude appearance from the behinds in performances before the popes.
No true Pope in history has allowed such immodesty in dress to be performed in front of the head of the Catholic Church.

Clara M,
All you do is insult people. I don't believe that you know or understand the True Catholic Faith. You are one of these progressive crowd who wants the Catholic Faith to be meaningless as long as you can claim that your "Conscience" is agreeable to the world and that obedience to the settled rules of the Catholic Faith can be disregarded if your own version of "conscience" allows you to basically do what you want without taking the 10 Commandments seriously and can find excuses to apply your version of the Faith to make it as you would wish it to be, instead of what it really is!!
Trent
http://members7.boardhost.com/TrueCatholic/index-1.html