Sunday, April 27, 2014

The University of Bristol, England must not allege that we Catholics accept an irrationality




That the deceased-saved are visible to us on earth is the personal view of Prof. Gavin D'Costa, a Catholic professor of theology at the University of Bristol,U.K.It is not the traditional teaching of the Catholic Church.
 
So the University of Bristol video must not allege that we Catholics accept this irrationality. Those who study at this university must note that a full time professor claims on a university video that the dead-saved are physically visible to him.
This is the accepted norm of reasoning in the philosophy and theology departments of this university.
 
Catholics in general cannot see the dead! To infer that they can is a falsehood!
  
There is no magisterial text which states Catholics can see the dead on earth. This is another falsehood in the video.
 


 The video does not cite Ad Gentes 7 (AG 7) of Vatican Council II which says all need 'faith and baptism'. AG 7 contradicts Prof.D'Costa hypothesis when he says  "People are not damned if they are not Catholics" (5:09)

The university needs to clarify :-
 
1) Their faculty cannot see the dead-saved.
 
2)  Neither can Catholics in general  see the dead saved with 'seeds of the Word'(AG 11) or that 'ray of that Truth'(NA 2).
 
3)There is no text in Vatican Council II which says we can see the dead-saved with 'seeds of the Word' or a 'ray of that Truth'.
 
4) Also if Prof. D'Costa  cannot see the dead-saved  with 'seeds of the Word' etc how can these cases be exceptions  to the traditional teaching on other religions?
 
5) From the Catholic perspective how can there be a theology of religions  if we do not know of a single person saved outside the visible limits of the Church, i.e without Catholic Faith and the baptism of water ?
 
6)The university must clarify that possibilities of salvation (NA 2 etc) are not known realities.What is invisible for us cannot also be visible for us.These cases saved are implicit for us and not explicit.They are accepted dejure (in principle) but are not known defacto.
-Lionel Andrades
 
 

Nostra Aetate does not state there are defacto, known cases saved in other religions

In another book of the SSPX it is implied that Nostra Aetate is an exception to the traditional teaching on salvation - extra ecclesiam nulla salus. This book is written by one of the SSPX bishops. I brought this to the attention of the SSPX priest Fr.Gabriel. I mentioned that Nostra Aetate 2 refers to the possibility of a non Catholic  being saved in his religion.It does not state that this is a defacto, known case.So how can it be an exception to extra ecclesiam nulla salus?
 
Where does Nostra Aetate 2 state that these are defacto, known cases or exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus ?
 
Here is Nostra Aetate 2.
 
2. From ancient times down to the present, there is found among various peoples a certain perception of that hidden power which hovers over the course of things and over the events of human history; at times some indeed have come to the recognition of a Supreme Being, or even of a Father. This perception and recognition penetrates their lives with a profound religious sense.
Religions, however, that are bound up with an advanced culture have struggled to answer the same questions by means of more refined concepts and a more developed language. Thus in Hinduism, men contemplate the divine mystery and express it through an inexhaustible abundance of myths and through searching philosophical inquiry. They seek freedom from the anguish of our human condition either through ascetical practices or profound meditation or a flight to God with love and trust. Again, Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination. Likewise, other religions found everywhere try to counter the restlessness of the human heart, each in its own manner, by proposing "ways," comprising teachings, rules of life, and sacred rites. The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men. Indeed, she proclaims, and ever must proclaim Christ "the way, the truth, and the life" (John 14:6), in whom men may find the fullness of religious life, in whom God has reconciled all things to Himself.(4)
The Church, therefore, exhorts her sons, that through dialogue and collaboration with the followers of other religions, carried out with prudence and love and in witness to the Christian faith and life, they recognize, preserve and promote the good things, spiritual and moral, as well as the socio-cultural values found among these men. -Nostra Aetate 2, Vatican Council II.(emphasis added)
 
The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men.
 
Being saved with 'a ray of that Truth' is a possibility. It can only be a possibility for us since these cases-saved would be known only to God.They can never be defacto known to us.The  text does not state that they are known to us personally in the present times, defacto.
-Lionel Andrades 
 
 
 
 
 

SSPX PRIEST SAYS THERE IS NO KNOWN EXCEPTION TO THE DOGMA EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS : BISHOP AND DISTRICT SUPERIOR SAY THERE ARE

 A possibility of salvation is not a known exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, so when Pope John Paul II and Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre  believed a non Catholic could be saved in another religion they were not saying that these are defacto, known cases? Or were they saying just that ?! These possibilities of salvation if they were defacto, known would be of course exceptions to exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church.
 
Today I spoke to a priest of the Society of St.Pius X, Albano and he said that he affirms the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus  and there are no known exceptions in 2014.
 

So Nostra Aetate 2 would refer to a possibility of salvation for a non Catholic. NA 2 does not say that these possibilities are defacto, known cases.The SSPX priest said that he did not know of any defacto case who could be saved without 'faith and baptism'(AG 7).
 
A possibility of salvation is not a known exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.This is the confusion also with the communities of Fr.Leonard Feeney, the Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary.
 
The supporters of Fr.Leonard Feeney are critical when  Archbishop Lefebvre  says a Hindu in Tibet can be saved in his religion.They should not be critical since this is not an exception.
 

When the Letter of the Holy Office  1949 mentioned a person can be saved with implicit desire , this is not an exception to the dogma!

This is the confusion among traditionalists .
 
 When I ask them if Vatican Council II is in agreement with the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus there is no answer.

The District Superior of the SSPX has written that Vatican Council II contradicts extra ecclesiam nulla salus.This book is being sold for 16 euros at the SSPX chapel in Rome.

 
For him a possibility of salvation mentioned in Vatican Council II ( NA 2 etc) is  assumed to be not just a possibility but also a known case in real life. It is as if the District Superior knows of such a case in Albano , the Italian Headquarters of the SSPX.If he did not know of such a case personally, how could it be an exception?
 
Father Pierpaolo Petrucci contradicts the SSPX priest with whom I spoke to today and also other SSPX priests at Albano.
 
If the District Superior did not imply  that Vatican Council II (NA 2)  states there are known cases saved 'outside the visible limits of the church' then there would be no exceptions in Vatican Council II to extra ecclesiam nulla salus and the traditional teaching on other religions.

The SSPX would have to admit that Archbishop Lefebvre made a mistake if he assumed there was known salvation  in another religion ( the Hindu saved in his religion in Tibet through Jesus and the Church).If he assumed a possibility is a known reality then he made a mistake,

Vatican Council II does not contradict extra ecclesiam nulla salus unless you assume possibilities are known realities, known exceptions.The SSPX priest says there are no known exceptions and an SSPX  bishop and the District Superior Italy in books published by the Society state their exist exceptions and these exceptions are mentioned in Vatican Council II.
-Lionel Andrades