Monday, April 15, 2013

Sedevacantists misinterpret Vatican Council II:with the same error as the liberal cardinals

With regard to the theoretical concept of the Vatican II sect’s ‘cardinals’ electing someone, of course anyone they would elect would be an invalid antipope; for all of the ‘cardinals’ are manifest heretics.  The fact that some of them are valid priests is irrelevant.  Every single one of them holds that Protestants are part of the Church (taught in Vatican II); that the ‘Orthodox’ are part of the Church (taught in Vatican II); that non-Catholics may receive Communion (taught in Vatican II); that there is salvation outside the Church (taught in Vatican II/the New Catechism); that participation in non-Catholic worship is good (taught in Vatican II and by the antipopes); that non-Christian religions are worthy of esteem (taught in Vatican II); that religious liberty should be a civil right (taught in Vatican II); etc. ad nauseam. -Most Holy Family Monastery. E-Exchanges http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/E-Exchanges.php
 Every single one of them holds that Protestants are part of the Church (taught in Vatican II);
(Vatican Council II does not state that Protestants in general are part of the Catholic Church. It only mentions that a Protestant could be saved. This is a big difference. A Protestant could be in imperfect communion with the Church (UR) and these cases are not visible to us. We do not know if such a case exists in 2013. If it said that Protestants are saved in general it would contradict Ad Gentes 7 which says all need Catholic Faith. Protestants do not have Catholic Faith.So the fault is with the MHFM liberal interpretation).

 that the ‘Orthodox’ are part of the Church (taught in Vatican II);
(Same as above).

that non-Catholics may receive Communion (taught in Vatican II);
(Non Catholics in general cannot receive the Eucharist however in an emergency a non Catholic could be given the Eucharist depending upon the circumstances and the decision of the Pastor.)

 that there is salvation outside the Church (taught in Vatican II/the New Catechism);
(Vatican Council II in Ad Gentes 7 says all need 'faith and baptism' for salvation. This is the traditional teaching on salvation according to the dogma defined three times.The Council does not mention any exceptions, since LG 16 etc are not visible to us.
Since the MHFM assumes that these cases are visible to us it interprets Vatican Council II as saying there is salvation outside the Church.The error is with the MHFM and not Vatican Council II).

 that participation in non-Catholic worship is good (taught in Vatican II and by the antipopes);
(?)

 that non-Christian religions are worthy of esteem (taught in Vatican II);
(Non Catholic religions have 'good and holy' things (NA).  Vatican Council II however does not say that non Catholic religions  are paths to salvation.Nostra Aetate does not mention this).

 that religious liberty should be a civil right (taught in Vatican II);...
(Religious liberty is a civil right according to secular Constituions. Vatican Council II (DH) does not say that Catholics do not have the freedom to profess their Faith including the teaching outside the church there is no salvation.They can still say that non Catholic religions are false paths to salvation with false worship based on AG 7 and LG 14.DH recognizes a secular reality only.)

The MHFM though are correct regarding the interpretation of the cardinals.This is the widely held liberal interpretation of Vatican Council II. However there is an alternative. The MHFM  could use the alternative interpretation of the Council even though the cardinals are in error.

Secondly the MHFM is making the same error of the cardinals without realizing it.The error of the cardinals arises from them assuming that LG 16,LG 8 etc are visible to us and not invisible. Based on this false observation,of being able to physically see the dead now saved, they have built up their theology and also interpretation of Vatican Council II.
If the MHFM assumes that invincible ignorance (LG 16) is invisible then LG 16 does not contradict AG 7. There are no exceptions to all needing  faith and baptism for salvation. Ad Gentes 7 interestingly is mentioned in the Catechism of the Catholic Church under the sub-title Outside the Church No Salvation.

The MHFM are making the same error as the cardinals in the interpretation of Vatican Council which must emerge as a break with Tradition with the false premise of being able to see the dead. So the fault is not with the Council but with the interpretation of the cardinals and the MHFM.
-Lionel Andrades

One does not have to be a sedevancatist to hold the traditional teaching on outside the church there is no salvation with no exceptions

Before receiving sacraments, one must reach the point where one is committed never to attend the New Mass again, believes in Outside the Church There is No Salvation without exception (no “baptism of desire,” no salvation for those “invincibly ignorant” of the Catholic faith), -Most Holy Family Monastery

The sedevacantists Peter and Michael Dimond state one must believe 'in Outside the Church There is No Salvation without exception (no “baptism of desire,” no salvation for those “invincibly ignorant” of the Catholic faith)..
I believe in No Salvation without exception.I do not have to be a sedevacantist.

 Then they say 'no “baptism of desire,” no salvation for those “invincibly ignorant” of the Catholic faith..' I too say there is no visible baptism of desire and there is no case known of a person saved in invincible ignorance. So once again there are no exceptions.Since there are no known exceptions, these cases are not visible to us outside the church there is no salvation does not contradict Vatican Council II.

So the Dimond brothers could the traditional understanding of the dogma on salvation alongwith Vaticn Council II if they make the distinction between visible and invisible baptism of desire, invincible ignorance etc.The baptism of desire is always invisible for us. Since the MHFM assumes that the baptism of desire is an exception to the dogma they imply that these cases are visible.This is irrational. How can one cannot be seen be an exception to anything ?

They would find what I am saying this hard to believe and probably think I am making this up. Since for them the baptism of desire and being saved in invincible ignorance are real and visible.

One does not have to be a sedevancatists to hold the traditional teaching on outside the church there is no salvation with no exceptions.It is even compatible with Vatican Council II and the Catechism of the Catholic Church along as it is remembered that LG 16 is invisible and LG 8 is just as invisible to us.-Lionel Andrades

Eucharistic Evangelisation

The lights were switched off in the church but there was enough glow to move around on Saturday night.The lights were all focused on the centre altar of the basilica where the Eucharist  was exposed in a golden monstrance.
 
It was about 9.15 p.m when I entered the Church and was on my knees in adoration. What a sight!There was Jesus in the Eucharist at the far end of the Church and so many people present .At night you don't see so many people in church. And what a visual impact was the sight of the Eucharist in the monstrance!
 
I went quietly to a corner and sat down. In the centre of the centre aisle it seemed the animator, the choir and electric guitars were all there. All with their attention on Jesus.
 
This was the basilica of Santa Anastasia al Palatino, Rome, near the grounds where Catholics were martyred for the Faith centuries back.It's in this church that they have Eucharistic Adoration 24 hours at a side altar, but today the Eucharist was there at the centre of the Church.
 
This was probably a Medugorje-Charismatic Renewal meeting and I liked it.And I'm sure Jesus did too.I was just soaking it all up  and if they continued  all night I would have remained sitting there.It would have been more difficult to leave.
 
It concluded with a Eucharistic procession. The priest brought the Eucharist  in the monstrance  down the aisle in benediction.The Eucharist was them placed at the side altar for silent adoration at 10.45 p.mThere were so many young people there.I noticed they were happy to be there and this form of worship was meaningful for them.Perhaps this group meets once a month. I would like to be there at their next meeting.Medugorje-Charismatic groups are using  stadiums in Italy for their prayer and conference meetings accompanied with Eucharistic adoration, silent and vocal.
 
On Saturday  nights if a church is open and a few people are within in prayer it is either Eucharistic Adoration organised by one such group or it  is Mass being held by the Neo Catechumenal Way (Kiko Arguello).
 
Medugorje has become an important movement in Italy. The last hymn they sang last night is a favourite of mine, Dona la Pace. I keep hearing it often in churches. It was composed at Medugorje by Roland  in Madare Rosaria's community (Adorers of the Precious Blood of Jesus).Roland is a young Italian inspired by all that is Medugorje.A few months back he was ordained a Deacon.One of the many vocations which has come to the Church from Medugorje.-Lionel Andrades

Vatican Council II agrees with St.Robert Bellarmine :depends if LG 16 is visible or invisible

Today morning I had a little time to visit the tomb of St.Robert Bellarmine in that magnificent basilica in central Rome.I thought to myself that St.Robert Bellarmine was in perfect sync with Vatican Council II in his understanding of exclusive salvation being there in only the Catholic Church.
The leftists call this triumphalism since they interpret Vatican Council II as a break with St.Robert Bellarmine and assert the absurd- that of Lumen Gentium 16 (invincible ignorance) being visible to us in 2013.Through their media they have conditioned just about every one to believe that we can see the dead saved in invincible ignorance , seeds of the word etc.
 
If we look at LG 16 as being known only to God, there being no explicit cases of invincible ignorance, then LG 16 is traditional and has a continuity with St. Robert Bellarmine.So if Vatican Council II is to be  pro or anti St.Robert Bellarmine,  depends if salvation in Vatican Council II is considered visible or invisible for us. It's simple.
It's on the basis of this factual error, of being able to physically see the dead, visible ghosts, that here is so much written on the Internet which considers Vatican Council II as a break with the thinking of that great Jesuit.-Lionel Andrades