Repost : Since for Ludwig Ott there are exceptions to EENS,the old Catechisms would also be a rupture with the past exclusivist ecclesiology.It would contradict an ecumenism of return and no salvation outside the Church

The same attitude is seen in humble compilers who write reliable summaries of the truths of Faith, constantly proclaimed and defended at the price of martyrs’ blood. In English one might think of the aptly named Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma by Fr. Ludwig Ott, or the Fundamentals of Catholicism by Fr. Kenneth Baker.

Poor Ludwig Ott, poor Kenneth Baker, whom the Henricis of the world have lumped in with those uneducated Protestants who believe in objective, unchanging truths of revelation!-Peter Kwasniewski, Why Catholicism is necessarily dogmatic, with a definite content       https://www.lifesitenews.com/blogs/why-catholicism-is-necessarily-dogmatic-with-a-definite-content

 JULY 2, 2018

Since for Ludwig Ott there are exceptions to EENS,the old Catechisms would also be a rupture with the past exclusivist ecclesiology.It would contradict an ecumenism of return and no salvation outside the Church

Since for Ludwig Ott the baptism of desire(BOD) , baptism of blood(BOB) and being saved in invincible ignorance (I.I)  are exceptions to Feeneyite EENS,the Catechisms of Trent, Baltimore and Pius X would also be a rupture with the past ecclesiology on ecumenism and outside the Church no salvation etc.Since when they refer to BOD, BOB and I.I, they would be interpreted as referring not to invisible cases but known people saved outside the Catholic Church.


CATECHISMS AND VATICAN COUNCIL II A RUPTURE WITH THE PAST FOR SCHNEIDER AND FASTIGGI

It is the same with Bishop Athansius Schneider and Dr.Robert Fastiggi.Not only would the Catechisms be a rupture with the past exclusivist ecclesiology because of the false premise but even Vatican Council II has to be a rupture with the past.This would be normal for Cushingites.

So they interpret LG 8 etc as being a visible example of salvation outside the Church.Vatican Council II is interpreted as a rupture with the past ecclesiology.So there are new doctrines in the Church on salvation.

BISHOP SCHNEIDER AND PROF. ROBERT FASTIGGI ARE CUSHINGITES AND LUDWIG OTT IS NOT A FEENEYITE
Last month it was announced that  Baronius Press released  a new edition of Ludwig Ott's Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma. Although based on the original translation by Dr. Patrick Lynch it has been "fully revised and updated" by Dr. Robert Fastiggi. The Foreword was written by Bishop Athanasius Schneider.

BOD, BOB AND I.I WOULD ALSO CONTRADICT THE SYLLABUS OF ERRORS FOR SANBORN AND PIVARUNAS

Similarly for the sedevacantist bishops Donald Sanborn and Mark Pivarunas, BOD,BOB and I.I are a rupture with Feeneyite extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS).So BOD, BOB and I.I would also contradict the Syllabus of Errors of Pope Pius IX on ecumenism.The old ecumenism of return would have practical  exceptions.

The sedevacantist bishops may criticize Fr.Leonard Feeny on EENS and will not affirm 'the strict interpretation' of EENS, like the Jesuits in the Middle Ages, but they still use the same faulty reasoning to interpret Vatican Council II irrationally.So the Council is a rupture with EENS(Feeneyite) for them.But without Cushingism as a philosophy and theology the Council supports Fr. Leonard Feeney.
VATICAN COUNCIL II SUPPORTS FR. LEONARD FEENEY

Without the irrational premise, without Cushingite theology; the New Theology, Vatican Council II supports Fr. Leonard Feeney.

Also the Catechism of the Catholic Church(1994) interpreted with Feeneyism would be in harmony with Vatican Council II( Feeneyite), EENS( Feeneyite), the Nicene Creed ( Feeneyite) etc.

TRADITIONAL MISSION
There would be mission/evangelisation, knowing that all non Catholics in 2018 are oriented to Hell unless they enter the Catholic Church with faith and baptism.There are no known exceptions.
It would also mean that all who have died as non Catholics are in Hell without faith and baptism and there are no known exceptions for us human beings. Faith and the baptism of water is the norm, the ordinary means of salvation.

CHURCH TELLS US THAT ALL NON CATHOLICS ARE IN HELL
So the Church tells us that all non Catholics are in Hell (Ad Gentes 7, Vatican Council II, the Council of Florence etc on extra ecclesiam nulla salus, the Catechism of the Catholic Church(845,846,1257 etc).

Bishop Schneider and Dr.Robert Fastiggi  are not willing to affirm this in public.They are comfortable with Vatican Council II (Cushingite)-Lionel Andrades

SATURDAY, JUNE 2, 2018

Baronius Press and Dr.Robert Fastiggi have brought out a new edition of Ludwig Otts Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma since it supports the present liberalism in the Catholic Church, with its Cushingite theology

Baronius Press and Dr.Robert Fastiggi have brought out a new edition of Ludwig OttsFundamentals of Catholic Dogma since it supports the present liberalism in the Catholic Church, with its Cushingite theology.

With Cushingism Dr. Fastiggi infers that Fr. Leonard Feeney and not the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 was in heresy.

With Cushingism Dr. Fastiggi reasons that Archbishop Lefebvre was wrong not to affirm the official Cushingite interpretation of Vatican Council II, which was a rupture with Tradition.

As a professor of theology in Detroit he has been given a mandatam to teach theology by the Archbishop since Dr. Fastiggi will not interpret Vatican Council II and extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) with Feeneyite philosophy and theology.For then Vatican Council II would be in harmony with the past exclusivist ecclesiology of the Church and the Syllabus of Errors.

With Vatican Council II (Feeneyite) Bishop Donald Sanborn whom Dr. Fastiggi debated on Ecclesiology, would not have to reject Vatican Council II as being in schism with the past popes on extra ecclesiam nulla salus and the past ecclesiology.There could only be an ecumenism of return based on the old ecclesiology and this would not be welcome for the liberals in Detroit or the USCCB.

If Dr. Fastiggi interprets Vatican Council II  with Feeneyism, he would not be in schism with the past popes, as he is presently in, with Cushingism theology,  but there would be a rupture with the Archdiocese of Detroit and the Rector of the Sacred Heart Major Seminary where he teaches. They interpret all Magisterial documents with Cushingism which creates the break with Tradition.

Since Ludwig Ott was not Feeneyite, he has contributed to the present doctrinal confusion in the Church and the Archdiocese of Detroit and the liberals promotes his book.-Lionel Andrades

JUNE 2, 2018

Ludwig Ott is in a rupture with the missionaries and Magisterium of the 16th century and Cantate Domino, Council of Florence 1441

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/message-incomplete-come-back-after-30.html

JUNE 1, 2018

Ludwig Ott's Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma is Cushingite, it overlooks an irrationality in the Letter of the Holy Office 1949.Bishop Athanasius Schneider and Prof Robert Fastiggi also use the false premise to interpret BOD, BOB and I.I and Magisterial documents to create a schism with the past popes

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/ludwig-otts-fundamentals-of-catholic.html

https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/07/since-for-ludwig-ott-there-are.html

Cardinal Gerhard Muller cites the Catechism of the Catholic Church but does not say that it affirms the strict interpretation of salvation

2. The Church Jesus Christ founded the Church as a visible sign and instrument of salvation realized in the Catholic Church (816). He gave His Church, which “emerged from the side of the Christ who died on the Cross” (766), a sacramental constitution that will remain until the Kingdom is fully achieved (CCC 765). Christ, the Head, and the faithful as members of the body, are a mystical person (CCC 795), which is why the Church is sacred, for the one Mediator has designed and sustained its visible structure (CCC 771). Through it the redemptive work of Christ becomes present in time and space via the celebration of the Holy Sacraments, especially in the Eucharistic Sacrifice, the Holy Mass (CCC 1330). The Church conveys with the authority of Christ the divine revelation, which extends to all the elements of doctrine, “including the moral teaching, without which the saving truths of the faith cannot be preserved, explained, and observed” (CCC 2035).-Cardinal Gerhard Muller, Manifesto of Faith

https://www.lifesitenews.com/images/local/Manifest_of_Faith-1.pdf

Cardinal Gerhard Muller cites the Catechism of the Catholic Church but does not say that it affirms the strict interpretation of salvation. Like Cardinal Walter Kasper he rejects the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) and the Syllabus of Errors ( ecumenism of return etc).

"Outside the Church there is no salvation" 

846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers? Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body: 

Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door.Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.

847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church: 

Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.

848 "Although in ways known to himself God can lead those who, through no fault of their own, are ignorant of the Gospel, to that faith without which it is impossible to please him,  Church still has the obligation and also the sacred right to evangelize all men."

-Catechism of the Catholic Church 846-848  1

Cardinal Muller instead interprets the passages in red as a rupture with the passage in blue and the rest of Tradition.

The Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith (CDF) has asked  Brother Andre Marie MICM, Prior of the St. Benedict Center, New Hampshire, USA to interpret CCC 847-848 as referring to known non Catholics saved outside the Church. In this way CCC 847-848  would be exceptions to the strict interpretation of the dogma EENS and Ad Gentes 7 ( blue passage).Where are the literal exceptions in 2019 ? Who has seen someone saved outside the Church ?

In an interview with Edward Pentin for the National Catholic Register, when Cardinal Gerhard Muller was asked about extra ecclesiam nulla salus he interpreted Vatican Council II as a rupture with the dogma EENS.For him 'the red was an exception to the blue'.2 Invisible cases of being saved in invincible ignorance were objective exceptions to the traditional interpretation of the dogma EENS for him.

Cardinal Muller also wanted the Society of St. Pius X to accept Vatican Council II as a rupture with Tradition and ignore the rational choice. He never said that Vatican Council II and the Catechism of the Catholic Church affirm the 'rigorist interpretation' of the dogma EENS.

In his Manifesto of Faith  he does not say like the SSPX General Chapter Statement on Doctrine(2012):-

For this reason it seems opportune that we reaffirm our faith in the Roman Catholic Church, the unique Church founded by Our Lord Jesus Christ, outside of which there is no salvation nor possibility to find the means leading to salvation. 3

Instead this doctrinal statement was rejected by Pope Benedict and Cardinal Muller.

-Lionel Andrades

1

JANUARY 26, 2019

The red is not an exception to the blue, the red does not contradict the blue : Catechism of the Catholic Church 846-848

https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/the-red-is-not-exception-to-blue-red.html

2

That has been discussed, but here, too, there has been a development of all that was said in the Church, beginning with St. Cyprian, one of the Fathers of the Church, in the third century. Again, the perspective is different between then and now. In the third century, some Christian groups wanted to be outside the Church, and what St. Cyprian said is that without the Church a Christian cannot be saved. The Second Vatican Council also said this: Lumen Gentium 14 says: “Whosoever, therefore, knowing that the Catholic Church was made necessary by Christ, would refuse to enter or to remain in it, could not be saved.” He who is aware of the presence of Revelation is obliged by his conscience to belong publicly — and not only in his conscience, in his heart — to this Catholic Church by remaining in communion with the Pope and those bishops in communion with him.

But we cannot say that those who are inculpably ignorant of this truth are necessarily condemned for that reason. We must hope that those who do not belong to the Church through no fault of their own, but who follow the dictates of their God-given conscience, will be saved by Jesus Christ whom they do not yet know. Every person has the right to act according to his or her own conscience. - Cardinal Gerhard Muller (10/02/2012 ). Archbishop Gerhard Müller: 'The Church Is Not a Fortress', National Catholic Register  http://www.ncregister.com/daily-news/archbishop-mueller-the-church-is-not-a-fortress/#ixzz3pwkg3Mur

3

http://archives.sspx.org/superior_generals_news/2012_general_chapter/2012_general_chapter_statement_7-19-2012.htm

________________________________________

Cardinal Muller, Archbishop Di Noia and Bishop Fellay's theology is based on invisible cases being visible, what is not seen as being seen

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2016/09/cardinal-muller-archbishop-di-noia-and.html

January 9, 2017    Cardinal Muller for ideological reasons has changed doctrine with an irrational theology to create magisterial heresy  http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/01/cardinal-muller-for-ideological-reasons.html

MAY 29, 2017 No one has issued a statement protesting against Cardinal Muller's error http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/05/no-one-has-issued-statement-protesting_29.html

Minim Fathers, at the Basilica of Sant Andrea delle Fratte, Rome are not teaching the strict interpretation of salvation (EENS) according to the Catechism of the Catholic Church(1994)

 

 The religious congregation of St Francis of Paula, the Minim Fathers, at the Basilica of Sant Andrea delle Fratte, Rome  are not teaching the strict interpretation of salvation (EENS) according to the Catechism of the Catholic Church(1994) issued by Pope John Paul II. 

The Catechism of the Catholic Church(CCC 846)  say all need faith and baptism for salvation, all need to be members of the Catholic Church to avoid Hell. However this is  not being taught at  Catechism classes.

CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH

 

 "Outside the Church there is no salvation"
846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers? Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:

Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.

847This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:

Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.

848 "Although in ways known to himself God can lead those who, through no fault of their own, are ignorant of the Gospel, to that faith without which it is impossible to please him, the Church still has the obligation and also the sacred right to evangelize all men."
-Catechism of the Catholic Church 846-848

The passages in red refer to hypothetical cases, theoretical possibilities and not personally known non Catholics saved outside the Church in the present times(2019).

The passage in blue agrees with the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) which says all need to be members of the Catholic Church, for salvation, all need faith and baptism to avoid the fires of Hell.

The passage in blue is the norm for salvation in the Catholic Church, it is the rule on how to go to Heaven, for all people,  as taught to the Church over the centuries, by the Holy Spirit.

 

For there to be an exception there would have to be a person saved outside the Church who is known and physically visible. An invisible person who does not exist in our reality cannot be an objective exception to all needing to be members of the Catholic Church for salvation.

So the passages in red are hypothetical only,always. They can only be hypothetical.1

 

During Catechism, the Minim Fathers interpret the passage in red as being an exception to the passage in blue.This is irrational. 

The Catechism of the Catholic Church is in harmony with the strict interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS), the past exclusive ecclesiology, an ecumenism of return and the Syllabus of Errors of Pope Pius IX.

It is in harmony with Vatican Council II interpreted with Feeneyism instead of irrational Cushingism.

 

The Minim Fathers need to tell young Catholics, and also their seminarians, that all need to be members of the Catholic Church for salvation and there are no known exceptions.

 

They need to tell young Catholics that outside the Catholic Church there is no known salvation.Those who die outside the Church are on the way to Hell.

This has been the teaching of the Church for centuries, based on Scripture and Tradition according to Vatican Council II (AG 7).We cannot separate Jesus from membership in the Catholic Church, for salvation( to avoid Hell).

 

At the basilica of St. Andrea delle Fratte, at the Altar of the Miracle, Alphonse RatIsbonne saw Our Lady. She showed him the beauty of the Catholic Church and its importance for the salvation of all people. 

He became a Catholic priest and founded two missionary congregations.

-Lionel Andrades

 

 

 

 

1.

January 26, 2019

The red is not an exception to the blue, the red does not contradict the blue : Catechism of the Catholic Church 846-848   https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/the-red-is-not-exception-to-blue-red.html

 

_________________________________________________

 

January 22, 2019

Catechism of the Catholic Church (n.846) affirms the strict and traditional interpretation of EENS defined by three Church Councils in the Extraordinary Magisterium 

 https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/catechism-of-catholic-church-n846.html

 

January 18, 2019

Outside the Church there is no salvation in the Catechism( N.846) affirms the strict interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus 

https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/outside-church-there-is-no-salvation-in.html 

 

January 16, 2019 

Catechism of the Catholic Church and Dominus Iesus 'constitutive of Catholic teaching ' do not contradict the strict interpretation of EENS : the CDF made an objective error 

https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/catechism-of-catholic-church-and.html 

 

January 19, 2019

Vatican Council II and the Catechism of the Catholic Church affirm the strict interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus : CDF, Diocese of Manchester irrational and heretical 

https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/vatican-council-ii-and-catechism-of.html 

 

January 23, 2019

The rational approach, the only approach, is that CCC 846 affirms the strict interpretation of the dogma EENS and there are no practical exceptions mentioned in CCC 846 or the rest of the Catechism

 https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/the-rational-approach-only-approach-is.html

 

January 12, 2019

There are only Catholics in Heaven according to Vatican Council II (Ad Gentes 7) and they are there with faith and baptism 

 https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/there-are-only-catholics-in-heaven.html

    

 

January 15, 2019

The Diocese of Manchester's Decree-Precepts-St.Benedict Center, issued by the Episcopal Vicar for Canonical Affairs is based on false reasoning 

 https://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2019/01/the-diocese-of-manchesters-decree.html