Archbishop Thomas E. Gullickson, Fr.S.Visintin osb, John Martignoni and Catholic priests in Rome say that the baptism of desire is not an exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.They are familiar with the basic laws of nature .Humans can only see visible things

When there is a dialogue we take it for granted that the understanding of physical reality is the same for the two persons in dialogue.If one of the persons in dialogue does not believe in the laws of nature and the other person does, there will be confusion. They will not be able to agree on basic things.

How I am to conduct a dialogue with a Catholic who indicates that we humans can see or know of people now in Heaven, saved without the baptism of water in the Catholic Church. People who did not receive the physical action of the baptism of water.This is not part of my reality. I cannot physically see such persons.

So in a discussion with another Catholic I assume that the baptism of desire, or being saved in some form without the baptism of water, is not part of my reality.I also assume that the physical conditions of not being able to see a baptism of desire case in 2016 also apply to other human beings.This is our common reality.May be a saint or an extraordinary person has this gift or grace to see people in Heaven without the baptism of water, but in general this is not the case with most people.

I am unable to begin a dialogue with a lay supporter of the SSPX in the USA since our understanding of physical reality, the laws of nature are different.

We both first have to find common ground which indicates that we both are on earth with the same physical perspective of the laws of nature.

In communication with his layman via e-mails, I  explained that Archbishop Thomas E. Gullickson,  Dean of Theology Fr.S.Visintin osb, John Martignoni and many Catholic diocesan priests in Rome say that the baptism of desire is not an exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. It cannot be an exception.Obviously they are familiar with the basic laws of nature and that we humans can only see visible things.So it is not a personal view of mine that there cannot be any known exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus in 2016. I base my view upon the laws of nature.-Lionel Andrades

July 19, 2016
You do not have any problem with the statements of Archbishop Gullickson, Fr. S.Visintin OSB, John Martignoni and the Brazilian priest I quoted? They say BOD is not an exception to EENS, it is invisible
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2016/07/you-do-not-have-any-problem-with.html