Every one needs to enter the Catholic Church for salvation and not only those who know : talk with young priest

Vatican Council II supports 'the black and white' teaching of the popes and saints on extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS).You are either ' in or out'. Vatican Council II is not a rupture for me with the past exclusivist ecclesiology of the Church, which taught that all non Catholics who have died are in Hell and those who are alive need to convert into the Catholic Church for salvation.

Jesus says in John 3:5 that all need the baptism of water for salvation. The baptism of water is given in a community.In Mark 16:16 Jesus says all need faith in Him for salvation and those who do not believe will be condemned.Those who do not come to God through Jesus will not receive salvation. This is how God the Father chooses salvation for all.

So like the popes and saints over the centuries, I believe all need to be members of the Catholic Church for salvation and not only those who know.

Today evening after Mass in Italian, I was talking to a young priest who in his homily said that evangelisation and catechesis is not only the responsibility of priests and nuns but also the laity.

But when I spoke to him personally he said that every one does not need to enter the Church for salvation but only ' those who know'. Those who are in ignorance can be saved he said.

He was citing Lumen Gentium 14 which is an error for me . But even with this error Lumen Gentium 14 does not contradict the popes and numerous saints on there being exclusive salvation in only the Catholic Church. You are either in or out. It is black or white.

Since, Lumen Gentium 14  does not state that we humans can know who will be saved in invincible ignorance outside the Church. If it did say this directly then it would be an exception to the old understanding on salvation.

But due to the error from the Letter of the Holy Office 1949, Lumen Gentium 14 does infer that there are known people saved in invincible ignorance outside the Church.So all do not need to enter the Catholic Church as members, but only those 'who know'.Those who are not in ignorance through no fault of their own,have to enter is the new reasoning.But only God can judge who knows and does not know and will be saved or not. So there are no practical examples for us, of people saved in invincible ignorance who are exceptions to the dogma EENS. There are no practical examples of people saved outside the Church, who did not know about Jesus and the Church.

So we are dealing with 'deadwood' here, a straw man. We cannot meet any one on earth who does not know about Jesus and the Church and who will be saved. We cannot name names.

So Vatican Council II says all need faith and baptism for salvation and hence the need for mission (Ad Gentes 7) and we cannot see or meet any one on earth who does not know about Jesus through no fault of his own and who will be saved(LG 14 etc).

So even with the error in Lumen Gentium 14, Vatican Council II does not contradict the strict interpretation of the dogma EENS.Since LG 14 is referring to a speculative case, a hypothetical person.

The young priest agreed with me.There were no objective cases of being saved in invincible ignorance for him too.

But the Vatican is not allowing priests to say this.If I cited this priest's name here, the Vicariate in Rome, which is under the Jewish Left rabbis, will telephone this priest directly or call up his superiors.

So I keep saying, whatever is your opinion of Fr. Leonard Feeney, due to ignorance or to be correct with the influential Left, Vatican Council II no where contradict Feeneyite EENS. 

Lumen Gentium 14 does not contradict Feeneyite EENS.

This is why I say that all non Catholics in 2018 are oriented to Hell and this is not just a personal view.This is the teaching of the Catholic Church before and after Vatican Council II. 

For me most people on earth are on the way to Hell since they die without faith and baptism in the Catholic Church (Ad Gentes7). So Vatican Council II for me is not a rupture with the popes and saints of the past, on salvation.

But I am not a priest and I cannot say this in Church.

I cite Vatican Council II to support my position on salvation being either black or white, in or out.Lumen Gentium 16 ( invincible ignorance) refers to hypothetical cases.No one disagrees with me here.They all agree with me that being saved in invincible ignorance refers to only hypothetical cases. There is no choice. It cannot be anything else.

So when this young priest said that not everyone needs to enter the Church but only those who know  he was repeating his liberal interpretation of Vatican Council II which has been approved by the Church to prevent what the Masons call 'triumphalism'.He has to pretend that Lumen Gentium 14 does not refer to hypothetical cases only. He has to pretend that the baptism of desire refers to known exceptions to the past exclusivist ecclesiology of the Church. This is what I discovered when talking to another priest last year from this same community.

So whatever is your opinion about Fr. Leonard Feeney, know that Vatican Council II supports him on EENS.Vatican Council II is Feeneyite.-Lionel Andrades


JUNE 16, 2018
Vatican Council II does not contradict the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS).FSSPX priests do not want to discuss thishttp://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/vatican-council-ii-does-not-contradict_16.html

JUNE 16, 2018
He is declared excommunicated but Vatican Council II is in agreement with Fr. Leonard Feeney's 'rigorist interpretation' of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS)
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/he-is-declared-excommunicated-but.html


JUNE 16, 2018
Vatican Council II supports the 'black and white position' on 'the Church's true teaching that "outside the Church there is no salvation"
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/vatican-council-ii-supports-black-and.html

JUNE 16, 2018
The Case of Fr. Leonard Feeney -No exceptions are mentioned in Vatican Council II to traditional EENS
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/the-case-of-fr-leonard-feeney-no.html

JUNE 16, 2018
Vatican Council II is not an exception to the dogma extra ecclesia nulla salus(EENS) as Fr. Leonard Feeney understood it
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/vatican-council-ii-is-not-exception-to.html

JUNE 16, 2018
Vatican Council II does not contradict extra ecclesiam nulla salus irrespective of your opinion on Fr.Leonard Feeney
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/vatican-council-ii-does-not-contradict.html

JUNE 16, 2018
Vatican Council II does not contradict extra ecclesiam nulla salus - whatever may be your view of Pope Pius XII and Fr.Leonard Feeney
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/06/message-incomplete-things-are-really-bad.html

 FEBRUARY 17, 2018

I affirm baptism of desire(BOD) Feeneyite and extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) Feeneyite.I do not reject BOD,baptism of blood (BOB)and being saved in invincible ignorance(I.I) which are always Feeneyite for me

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2018/02/i-affirm-baptism-of-desirebod-feeneyite.html

DECEMBER 26, 2017

The Most Holy Family Monastery like the SSPX and SSPX Resistance groups interpret Vatican Council II with Cushingism instead of Feeneyism, they use a false premise

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2017_12_26_archive.html

DECEMBER 26, 2017

Will the German Bishops go into schism because of Vatican Council II?

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2017/12/will-german-bishops-go-into-schism.html

DECEMBER 22, 2017

Get a new perspective on Vatican Council II only on the blog Eucharist and Mission(Lionel's blog)

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2017/12/get-new-perspective-on-vatican-council.html

DECEMBER 22, 2017

Mark Shea continues to reject the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus :hypothetical cases mentioned in Vatican Council II are real people saved outside the Church for him. Possibilities are known exceptions to EENS

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/mark-shea-continues-to-reject-dogma.html

 

DECEMBER 22, 2017

Cardinal Kasper uses specious reasoning to further ecumenism and reject the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/cardinal-kasper-uses-specious-reasoning.html

DECEMBER 22, 2017

'Rome must come back to the Faith' : it does not have to be either the baptism of desire or extra ecclesiam nulla salus

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/rome-must-come-back-to-faith-it-does.html

DECEMBER 21, 2017

Franciscans of the Immaculate, SSPX, SBC can have their situation regularised : the doctrinal puzzle has been solved

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/franciscans-of-immaculate-sspx-sbc-can.html

DECEMBER 21, 2017

It does not have to be either the baptism of desire or extra ecclesiam nulla salus : Just one Religious Superior is needed to understand and affirm this and we will have changed the Church

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/it-does-not-have-to-be-either-baptism_92.html

DECEMBER 16, 2017

Repost : Pope Benedict made an objective mistake in 2016 he supports inter faith marriages and adultery(graphics)

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/repost-pope-benedict-made-objective.html

DECEMBER 15, 2017

Pledge of Fidelity signatories reject de fide teachings of the Catholic Church and support a new irrational theology

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/pledge-of-fidelity-faithful-to-true.html

DECEMBER 16, 2017

Repost : Fr.Chad Ripperger and FSSP priests not permitted by the Vatican to affirm the traditional teaching on salvation

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2017/12/repost-frchad-ripperger-and-fssp.html

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