SALVATION AND THE CHURCH
LUKE 13:23: 'LORD, ARE THEY FEW THAT ARE SAVED?'
The Catholic Church infallibly teaches the truth that "Outside the Church, there is no salvation." The Church isn't saying here that only Catholics go to Heaven but that all graces needed for salvation originate in Christ and pass through His Mystical Body, the Church.
Lionel: The Catholic Church is saying here that there are only Catholics in Heaven. If there are non Catholics who are going to Heaven, in Heaven they will only be Catholic. The Church is saying this when Magisterial Documents( Councils, Creeds and Catechisms) are interpreted rationally and not irrationally. Bradley Eli interprets Vatican Council II irrationally.
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Section 846 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church affirms that this dogma does mean "All salvation comes from Christ the head through the Church, which is His body."
Lionel: Yes all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church, which is His Body and all need to enter the Catholic Church with faith and the baptism of water for salvaton ( Ad Gentes 7, Lumen Gentium 14, Catechism of the Catholic Church 845, 846, Fourth Lateran Council (1215) etc). When Vatican Council II and the Catechism of the Catholic Church are interpreted rationally there is no contradiction. There is no rupture with the Fourth Council of Florence (1215) on the strict interpretation of EENS, with no known exceptions.
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Those unable to know this truth have what's called invincible ignorance. A little Jewish girl who dies at the age of 6 might be such a person.
Lionel : Yes there could be someone in invincible ignorance and if the person is to be saved this case would only be known to God. For us humans they are theoretical and speculative. We cannot point out any person and say that this or that person will go to Heaven even if he is in invincible ignorance. We cannot meet or see someone saved in invincible ignorance. They are invisible in our reality. So they are not practical exceptions for the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus ( Council of Florence 1442).
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Of these, Pope Pius IX in his 1863 encyclical, Quanto Conficiamur Moerore, wrote:
It is known to Us and to you that they who labor in invincible ignorance of our most holy religion and who, zealously keeping the natural law and its precepts engraved in the hearts of all by God, and being ready to obey God, live an honest and upright life, can, by the operating power of divine light and grace, attain eternal life, since God ... will by no means suffer anyone to be punished with eternal torment who has not the guilt of deliberate sin.
Lionel: Yes and we cannot project this case of invincible ignorance as an exception for the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS). It was known to Pope Pius IX that these are theoretical cases and not objective exceptions for the dogma EENS.That these are hypothetical cases is common sense. It was known through the centuries.
It was only in 1949 in the Letter of the Holy Office (CDF) that a mistake was made. It was assumed that invincible ignorance was a visible case. Bradley Eli makes this mistake. This is the common formation- error in the Catholic seminaries and universities all over the world.
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As cited in Denzinger §1677, Pius IX adds:
But, the Catholic dogma that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church is well known; and also that those who are obstinate toward the authority and definitions of the same Church, and who persistently separate themselves from the unity of the Church, and from the Roman Pontiff, the successor of Peter, to whom "the guardianship of the vine has been entrusted by the Savior," cannot obtain eternal salvation.
Lionel : The 1949 Letter of the Holy Office was placed in the Denzinger by the liberals. It was put there along with its objective mistake. Catholics are not obligated to follow the second part of the 1949 LOHO which contradicts the first part which affirmed traditional EENS. It does this with a fake premise.
The 1949 LOHO is not Magisterial, even though it was accepted by Rahner, Ratzinger, Kung and Congar, since the Holy Spirit cannot make an objective mistake. With this objective mistake, confusing what is invisible as being visible, unknown as being known, alleged practical exceptions were created for the Magisterial interpretation of EENS over the centuries.
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Vatican II repeats this admonition in Lumen Gentium §14: "Whosoever, therefore, knowing that the Catholic Church was made necessary by Christ, would refuse to enter or to remain in it, could not be saved. ... Not only shall they not be saved but they will be the more severely judged."
Lionel : Yes whoever knows and does not enter is oriented to Hell. But it does not mean that we know of any one in particular who will go to Heaven outside the Church, with invincible ignorance. All people in general need Catholic faith and the baptism of water for salvation (AG 7). All. Those who know and those who do not know, need to accept Jesus in only the Catholic Church for salvation ( to avoid Hell ). Lumen Gentium 14 refers to those ‘who know’ since the Council Fathers, the liberals, interpreted 'being saved in invincible ignorance', irrationally, like the 1949 LOHO. They assumed that the baptism of desire (BOD) and being saved in invincible ignorance (I.I) referred to 'known and visible non Catholics' in 1949-1965 who were saved outside the Catholic Church, without faith and the baptism of water. But the Councils from the 12th to the 16th century are clear. All need to be members of the Church for salvation. All. The word all is also used in Ad Gentes 7. It says all need faith and the baptism of water, for salvation (AG 7, Vatican Council II) The BOD and I.I are not exceptions or relevant for AG 7 or the dogma EENS.
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